Story Comic for 2016 April 25th

[Scotty 1,061]

19 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

All 4 instances was when he realized something. The love for Grace was red herring.

That's what I'm saying, the flash corresponds to the moment of realization, it just happens to be a visual effect that everyone can see. But just because Tedd took what he's seen and come up with a very plausible theory, doesn't necessarily mean it's right. There was that discussion in another about how people figured out how things worked even though they didn't know why it worked. This is kinda similar, Tedd may believe he understands what happened to Elliot, and it may partially be right, but the "why it happened" is on the level of something that only Magic know's the reason, so whether it was confusion, or intention that gave Elliot the girly spells first, will probably remain a mystery, unless whatever spell Elliot just got gives clear evidence to it.

1 hour ago, BurntAsh said:

Another question I have is: even if Elliot gets the ability to transform into a male superhero, will it get used? Or will Elliot keep going back to the Cheerleadra form because of a preference for it?

This is a good question, I'm sure having the option is nice, as it doubles Elliot's already infinite number of forms (he had an infinite number of female forms, now he'd have an infinite number of male forms) but whether he'll use those often or default to female forms more is another thing, if he continues to stick with the female forms then what would happen?

[Stature 96]

2 hours ago, Arcanimus said:

Is there any reason for him not to?

Little sight-related oopsies.

Nanase, anyway, in any form, at the moment, is having the best shotgun. The lack of motion does perceive that it is just a Nanase doll.

[Don Edwards 548]

5 hours ago, Wildcat said:

Personally, I think it makes as much sense for him and Ellen to be agender or nearly so. The preference for being one or the other sometimes could easily be wanting to experience things differently. 

He doesn't really seem to care about the girl vs boy part of it so much? It seems like what he likes about one or the other form has to do with things secondary to gender or the sex of the body: anonymity, feeling attractive in a particular way, gender roles (how people treat him/what people find acceptable), height/perspective, seeing more colors of red, everything cheerleadra...  Whereas Tedd seems to have a more basic need to specifically be a girl some of the time. He still enjoys much of the other stuff, but it doesn't seem to be the driving force.

I could be wrong, but I would put Elliot as agender, or agender to mildly genderfluid.

Definitions of terms in this area are still in flux, but I'd class Elliot as gender-neutral rather than agender. Among those most involved with the issue, "agender" is becoming more defined as the absence of gender identity, where "gender-neutral" is a more or less balanced and unstressful presence of both male and female gender identity. Elliot has embraced being male, and owned being female ("I'm cute and sexy", not "this form is cute and sexy"), and since learning that he was awakened hasn't shown much sign of feeling internal conflict over it.

(Granted, you can easily find instances of broader definitions of "agender" - occasionally you'll even find definitions that include Tedd and possibly Sam.)

As for Elliot being genderfluid, I don't think we've seen any evidence for it. We've never (since learning he's awakened) seen him voluntarily change sex just for the sake of being the other sex for a while, without some non-gender-related reason it seemed desirable or necessary; and we've never seen him reluctant to change sex when there was a reason it was a good idea to do so and no stronger reason not to. However, it's still possible, particularly if (as you suggest) he's only mildly genderfluid.

[Xenophon Hendrix 47]

My wild guess is that Elliot just got a spell that will help him deal with being outed as Cheerleadra.

[Circe 32]

4 hours ago, Xenophon Hendrix said:

My wild guess is that Elliot just got a spell that will help him deal with being outed as Cheerleadra.

That's an interesting thought.  Maybe something like Nanase's Fox spell, something that would let super-Elliot and Elliot appear at the same time?

[Scotty 1,061]

7 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

As for Elliot being genderfluid, I don't think we've seen any evidence for it. We've never (since learning he's awakened) seen him voluntarily change sex just for the sake of being the other sex for a while, without some non-gender-related reason it seemed desirable or necessary; and we've never seen him reluctant to change sex when there was a reason it was a good idea to do so and no stronger reason not to. However, it's still possible, particularly if (as you suggest) he's only mildly genderfluid.

Well there was the moment earlier in Elliot and Ashley's date, shortly after he transformed into Mall Girl. When Ashley asked if he was comfortable with being a girl, Elliot stated that "I guess sometimes I feel like being one more than the other." which could be enough evidence to say Elliot is genderfluid. But I don't think he was always that way like Tedd was, this could have been something Elliot never would have considered if he never got zapped in the first place.

It makes me think that if everyone had the ability, either through magic or technology, to switch between genders at will, a good portion of people would likely become genderfluid.
 

[ijuin 572]

23 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

I think the doll tucked in the skirt is just a doll at this point.  Nanase has left the building.

Is Elliot simply talking back to the GPS, talking to the voices inside the skull, or is there someone else on the phone?

And yes, Elliot should start wearing cargo pants filled with high end electronics at all times.,,, Or NO!  Even better than cargo pants would be a lab coat with lots of pockets.  I'm sure Tedd has few extra lying around.

Yes, the Nanase doll tucked in Elliot's waistband is cute!

Talking back to the voice in your head is often a sign of madness . . .

Anyway, I like the poses in the 4th and 6th panels. Elliot is indeed owning the Cheerleadra form and identity.

Also, Elliot has confirmed here that the Cheerleadra form has super strength. Not "more powerful than a locomotive", but definitely strength that is implausible for a human--stronger than non-Guardian Nanase, likely stronger than Greg, and possibly able to lift an automobile overhead.

3 hours ago, Scotty said:

Well there was the moment earlier in Elliot and Ashley's date, shortly after he transformed into Mall Girl. When Ashley asked if he was comfortable with being a girl, Elliot stated that "I guess sometimes I feel like being one more than the other." which could be enough evidence to say Elliot is genderfluid. But I don't think he was always that way like Tedd was, this could have been something Elliot never would have considered if he never got zapped in the first place.

It makes me think that if everyone had the ability, either through magic or technology, to switch between genders at will, a good portion of people would likely become genderfluid.
 

Considering the number of people who want to change their bodies' apparent sex in spite of being made social outcasts for doing so (hundreds of thousands in America alone), I would expect that easily ten times as many (or more) would do so if it were reversible, safe, and not a source of social rejection. Everybody has had at least idle curiosity about how "the other half" lives, even if they don't want to transform on a permanent basis.

[Scotty 1,061]

2 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Considering the number of people who want to change their bodies' apparent sex in spite of being made social outcasts for doing so (hundreds of thousands in America alone), I would expect that easily ten times as many (or more) would do so if it were reversible, safe, and not a source of social rejection. Everybody has had at least idle curiosity about how "the other half" lives, even if they don't want to transform on a permanent basis.

I wasn't even including Trans people in that statement, I would imaging if the ability was available, they'd probably use it in a heartbeat. But certainly many cis people would be curious about it, me for instance, I'm a guy, I'm totally comfortable being a guy, there's a lot of things about being a girl that I wouldn't want to deal with, but if the option to switch back and forth safely and easily was available, I'd be curious enough to try it for a bit. Whether I end up liking it or not is something I can't answer because I don't know what it's like so it really could go either way.

[ijuin 572]

Hmm, if there were no social-rejection aspect to it (including being able to still like/marry girls without social rejection), then I might choose to be permanently female. I might be like Elliot--"I'm cute and sexy and I love this form", though I might want to mix it up now and then . . .

[Wildcat 37]

12 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Definitions of terms in this area are still in flux, but I'd class Elliot as gender-neutral rather than agender. Among those most involved with the issue, "agender" is becoming more defined as the absence of gender identity, where "gender-neutral" is a more or less balanced and unstressful presence of both male and female gender identity. Elliot has embraced being male, and owned being female ("I'm cute and sexy", not "this form is cute and sexy"), and since learning that he was awakened hasn't shown much sign of feeling internal conflict over it.

(Granted, you can easily find instances of broader definitions of "agender" - occasionally you'll even find definitions that include Tedd and possibly Sam.)

As for Elliot being genderfluid, I don't think we've seen any evidence for it. We've never (since learning he's awakened) seen him voluntarily change sex just for the sake of being the other sex for a while, without some non-gender-related reason it seemed desirable or necessary; and we've never seen him reluctant to change sex when there was a reason it was a good idea to do so and no stronger reason not to. However, it's still possible, particularly if (as you suggest) he's only mildly genderfluid.

With the given definitions, I agree that "gender-neutral" seems to fit better

[BurntAsh 10]

15 hours ago, Scotty said:

This is a good question, I'm sure having the option is nice, as it doubles Elliot's already infinite number of forms (he had an infinite number of female forms, now he'd have an infinite number of male forms) but whether he'll use those often or default to female forms more is another thing, if he continues to stick with the female forms then what would happen?

I dunno, but honestly, I'm more interested in the implications to Elliot's character than whether or not he will be able to be male in his forms. Because there's been plenty of hints that while he has knee-jerk/shy reactions to "being cute", he doesn't actually hate it. Ellen didn't rail against it either. So I'm curious what this reveals about Elliot. But I do find it interesting that there is a group of people who seem to be invested in Elliot's ability to be something other than female when using magic. 

16 hours ago, hkmaly said:

(For record, I still thinks the reasons for these things is weak and he likely got something else. But it's more likely for him to get something from this list than heat vision.)

For the record, heat vision wasn't a serious suggestion. Of all the parts to nitpick, you people nitpick the power that I randomly pull off of Superman's long list?  

57 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Considering the number of people who want to change their bodies' apparent sex in spite of being made social outcasts for doing so (hundreds of thousands in America alone), I would expect that easily ten times as many (or more) would do so if it were reversible, safe, and not a source of social rejection. Everybody has had at least idle curiosity about how "the other half" lives, even if they don't want to transform on a permanent basis.

It depends, I think, since you are going to run into many different reasons to do it, and many different reasons not to. You'd probably be best doing a survey to actually know what the breakdown looks like. And you'd probably want to look at frequency as well, since I suspect you will see that the number who would try it would be high but the frequency for the majority would be very low. But I've seen people give nearly every explanation I can think of both for and against doing if it if they could just do it without risking anything. 

[Scotty 1,061]

54 minutes ago, BurntAsh said:

But I do find it interesting that there is a group of people who seem to be invested in Elliot's ability to be something other than female when using magic. 

It goes back to Tedd's theory that if Elliot wants non-girly spells, he has to like the girly spells he has first. So basically we've just seen the moment that Elliot truly loves being Cheerleadra, and his book seems to have noticed this so it's not unlikely that he's finally got a non-girly spell. It's probably a good sign that he wasn't forced to change into a male Cheerleadra so that should mean the female superhero spell is still intact, it might have been updated to allow Elliot to chose what gender he wants to be though. I think there would be riots if it turned out Elliot could only use a male superhero form from now on, with Elliot leading the pack.

[BurntAsh 10]

Well, it is more like the assumption is that "non-girly" means "can be a dude", rather than it not having to do explicitly with being about transformation, and that this is somehow important for Elliot. I dunno, it feels a bit like projection? Perhaps because I've done it myself to other characters often enough (Egad it took a while to realize how much I was projecting onto Ash in Misfile), and perhaps I'm even doing it a little here. But don't get me wrong, I'm not judging, but I do find it interesting. If anything, it says more about how people identify with the character of Elliot than anything else.

[Cpt. Obvious 73]

Ohhh! A new spell for Elliot...

If I were Magic I'd give him an awesome autopilot... that followed the GPS instructions to the letter including obeying speed limits, traffic lights, and always stopping for pedestrians crossing the road. I'm not sure if I'd make him follow the roads at a height of six feet, or fifty, either way he'd be at the mercy of traffic, the spell having him follow the rhythm of road bound traffic while paying no attention to birds, drones or anything else that flies. I can visualize the look on her friends faces when they learn that Cheerleadra is stuck in traffic and can't figure out how to disengage the autopilot...

It's probably a good thing that it's Dan writing this comic and not me... 

[Wildcat 37]

2 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

Ohhh! A new spell for Elliot...

If I were Magic I'd give him an awesome autopilot... that followed the GPS instructions to the letter including obeying speed limits, traffic lights, and always stopping for pedestrians crossing the road. I'm not sure if I'd make him follow the roads at a height of six feet, or fifty, either way he'd be at the mercy of traffic, the spell having him follow the rhythm of road bound traffic while paying no attention to birds, drones or anything else that flies. I can visualize the look on her friends faces when they learn that Cheerleadra is stuck in traffic and can't figure out how to disengage the autopilot...

It's probably a good thing that it's Dan writing this comic and not me... 

that is incredibly ridiculous, very unlikely to ever happen, and hilarious

[hkmaly 490]

15 hours ago, Xenophon Hendrix said:

My wild guess is that Elliot just got a spell that will help him deal with being outed as Cheerleadra.

How? ... wouldn't such spell be more powerful than Nanase's guardian form?

6 hours ago, Scotty said:

7 hours ago, ijuin said:

11 hours ago, Scotty said:

It makes me think that if everyone had the ability, either through magic or technology, to switch between genders at will, a good portion of people would likely become genderfluid.

Considering the number of people who want to change their bodies' apparent sex in spite of being made social outcasts for doing so (hundreds of thousands in America alone), I would expect that easily ten times as many (or more) would do so if it were reversible, safe, and not a source of social rejection. Everybody has had at least idle curiosity about how "the other half" lives, even if they don't want to transform on a permanent basis.

I wasn't even including Trans people in that statement, I would imaging if the ability was available, they'd probably use it in a heartbeat. But certainly many cis people would be curious about it, me for instance, I'm a guy, I'm totally comfortable being a guy, there's a lot of things about being a girl that I wouldn't want to deal with, but if the option to switch back and forth safely and easily was available, I'd be curious enough to try it for a bit. Whether I end up liking it or not is something I can't answer because I don't know what it's like so it really could go either way.

Being curious is not the same as becoming genderfluid. The number of people who would try would be definitely big (and likely includes everyone reading this comics) but without the additional advantages of FV5 form only the people who are already genderfluid and just not realizing it would keep doing it.

With the FV5 form advantages, though, I can easily imagine people using it to solve other body shape problems. I mean, if I had 20kg more ...

6 hours ago, ijuin said:

if there were no social-rejection aspect to it (including being able to still like/marry girls without social rejection)

Wouldn't this mostly depend on that girl?

 

 

[PSadlon 88]

On 4/25/2016 at 3:06 PM, Circe said:

Personally I think an equine form for Elliot would be great!

Ashley may or may not appreciate that.

On 4/25/2016 at 6:11 PM, Scotty said:

It's the Edward Verres approach to covering up conspiracies. The more you try to draw attention to something, the less likely people are to notice it.

HHGG refers to it as a SEP or Somebody Else's Problem field.

[InfiniteRemnant 141]

46 minutes ago, PSadlon said:

On 4/25/2016 at 4:11 PM, Scotty said:

It's the Edward Verres approach to covering up conspiracies. The more you try to draw attention to something, the less likely people are to notice it.

HHGG refers to it as a SEP or Somebody Else's Problem field.

sounds like a more reliable version of a perception filter.

[CptNerd 9]

On 25 April 2016 at 5:22 PM, The Old Hack said:

It's kind of an old joke on Dan's part. At some point he decided to declare War on Vowels and tried to see how many sound effects he could create that didn't have vowels in them.

So, he's part Welsh?

[Stature 96]

56 minutes ago, CptNerd said:

So, he's part Welsh?

*recites the full name of Llanfair PG*

Nah, he is part Kiwi.

[Scotty 1,061]

6 hours ago, Stature said:

*recites the full name of Llanfair PG*

Nah, he is part Kiwi.

The bird or the fruit?

[Stature 96]

14 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The bird or the fruit?

The human, silly.

But if to choose from either of the two, the fruit.  

[ijuin 572]

15 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Wouldn't this mostly depend on that girl?

 

I more meant without being rejected by society-at-large for it.

 

[The Old Hack 2,448]

A question just occurred to me:

The first time Elliot was ever turned into a girl, I am fairly sure Elliot's gender identity was that of a boy turned into a girl, i. e. still considering himself male.

Over time, this seems to have gradually changed. I wonder if today's comic's moment of acceptance also marks that Elliot now fully considers herself a girl while transformed into her superhero identity or other variations of female selves?

[ProfessorTomoe 1,308]

9 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

I wonder if today's comic's moment of acceptance also marks that Elliot now fully considers herself a girl while transformed into her superhero identity or other variations of female selves?

I think he's more enamored with the form. The fact that he has to become female to attain it simply no longer bugs him. IMHO.