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Scotty

Story, Wednesday August 31, 2016

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The drama had to be expounded further, so there is that.

16 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Well, the half sister theory is still on the table at least.

Though the exact notion of genetics is nearly out the window. So Pa Baker is the main (and only) source of their genes, which might or might not make sense.

How it might? Say, what if the mothers are also twins/half-sisters?

And why is Nanase with Edward in the first place, anyway? :demonicduck:

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Just now, Stature said:

The drama had to be expound further, so there is that.

Though the exact notion of genetics is nearly out the window. So Pa Baker is the main (and only) source of their genes, which might or might not make sense.

How it might? Say, what if the mothers are also twins/half-sisters?

Well this would confirm that the vampire hunter talents come from the father's side.

As I said in the previous thread, the half-sister/cousin thing has been done before, it'd be interesting if Dan went that route with Susan and Diane, but honestly that was just a wild theory of mine and won't hold him to it.

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The only way I can think of that explains away the genetics side of things is that BOTH Susan and Diane were born to the blonde woman. How that fits in with Diane being put up for adoption is a bit fuzzy but maybe feasible. 

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I don't think the hospital birth records would necessarily mention that Susan came from a donated egg. Or a zygote from an in-vitro fertilization, especially if the procedure wasn't done at that hospital. The zygote could have split, so two (or more) different women could have given birth to genetically identical babies.

So there is still some wiggle room here. It's going to take some time for the haze to clear.

 

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39 minutes ago, Wrothmonk said:

The only way I can think of that explains away the genetics side of things is that BOTH Susan and Diane were born to the blonde woman. How that fits in with Diane being put up for adoption is a bit fuzzy but maybe feasible. 

But I think Mrs. Pompom would have noticed that.  For Mr. Verres to be so certain, the birth records would have to indicate Mrs. Pompom is Susan's biological mother, and Mrs. Pompom would most certainly know that Susan was her daughter (unless there was a mix-up at birth, which is a rather dark turn to take).

But one thing that has to be noted is that Susan shares her hair color with neither her father or Mrs. Pompom.  And Jerry said that Diane was Susan's long-lost sister.  Unless there is something Mr. Verres missed (depending on how you interpret "long-lost sister"), shouldn't have Jerry been more specific?

That said, Verres only checked Susan's record, so we might see things cleared up a bit more if he dug around Diane's birth record.  But if Mr. Pompom is parent to both Diane and Susan, that's a very bloody big coincidence for both children to be born within twenty minutes of one another, and grow up looking like twins with a hair color they couldn't have inherited from dear old Dad.

All we know right now is that Mr. Verres indirectly confirmed that Diane is the only one who was adopted.

 

 

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In real-life genetics, brown/black hair is dominant over blonde. Let "B" represent a gene for brown/black hair, and "b" for blonde. If both parents are "Bb", then one-fourth of possible genetic combinations will be "bb". Thus, two parents who have dark hair but both carry genes for lighter hair could produce blonde children.

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K^2    2
3 hours ago, Stature said:

Though the exact notion of genetics is nearly out the window. So Pa Baker is the main (and only) source of their genes, which might or might not make sense.

How it might? Say, what if the mothers are also twins/half-sisters?

It's not entirely uncommon for half-siblings to look strikingly similar. If Susan's father went for similar phenotypes, this would already reduce possible variation. And if facial structure just happens to be dominated by features due to a handful of linked dominant genes, you have it down to a coin flip.

I mean, think about it this way, have you never seen siblings who look almost identical other than the age difference? But only about half of their genes are the same. The other half is inherited from different grandparents. Yet, often enough, they share the specific genes that happen to play a role in features we used to distinguish people from one another, because there aren't as many of these, and they are frequently linked.

Case in point, if Susan's father is natural blond, and happens to have a thing for natural blonds, then we're basically guaranteed for daughters both being blond. One seemingly random similarity is no longer random.

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Edward did thorough background checks on Tedd's friends.  Until New Year's Eve, Diane was only an acquaintance to Nanase.

As protective as Edward is, I don't think he would have time to investigate everyone who ever spoke to his niece.

As for hair color?  My dad had blond hair when he was drafted, but it grew back brown after his discharge.  Susan's mother may have been blonde when Tiffany was born, but by the time Susan discovered her father was a cheating cheater who cheated, her hair may have darkened significantly.  And in the EGS world, spontaneously changing hair color IS a recognized medical condition.

 

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30 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Edward did thorough background checks on Tedd's friends.  Until New Year's Eve, Diane was only an acquaintance to Nanase.

As protective as Edward is, I don't think he would have time to investigate everyone who ever spoke to his niece.

 

 

Just for what it's worth, Top Secret background checks go two levels deep, at least in theory.  Or at least that is what they told us back in the day. 

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40 minutes ago, Aura Guardian said:

On the grounds that Jerry might not have thought "half" was a good idea to mention, I'll STILL refrain from the speculation, but I'm glad that at least "half-sister" is on the table.

Really "half" isn't worth mentioning.  People get into really odd arguments about kinship terms. They're not usually technical vocabulary.  Most languages are perfectly willing to let you use "sister" for any female relative or close friend of about your generation.  Even in English there are plenty of people who use it for women belonging to my church, or even of the same race.

 

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2 hours ago, mlooney said:

It's a bit strange to me that DGB can't get at adoption papers.

Well, could be either that the adoption papers are either not well kept, or the agency that maintains them is less willing to let FBI agents access them without a good reason and/or consent of the relevant parties. Getting a background check typically requires signing a form to grant permission to access the relevant records. At least that's the case when I've been hired to places that would like to perform background checks on perspective employees.

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42 minutes ago, Drasvin said:

Well, could be either that the adoption papers are either not well kept, or the agency that maintains them is less willing to let FBI agents access them without a good reason and/or consent of the relevant parties. Getting a background check typically requires signing a form to grant permission to access the relevant records. At least that's the case when I've been hired to places that would like to perform background checks on perspective employees.

Yeah, the background checks Edward's done on Tedd's friends were likely easy enough to do, Edward could have sneaked glances at Susan's record while looking for records of someone else that DGB was looking for or something. Or maybe some other excuse to go looking through records at any given time. Adoption records would be treated pretty much like top secret files where only certain people are allowed to retrieve them and you'd need a pretty darned good reason to look at them, like if a person was a possible terrorist or something. "I need to look at them because the person is a friend of my niece" wouldn't cut it.

Hmm...so here's a thought, Diane and Susan were born 20 minutes apart, that suggests they were conceived on the same day 9 months earlier, that would kinda be tough for a cheating cheater to accomplish without the women knowing about it, which would be acceptable if we stick with the theory that Diane's biological mom is Mrs Pompom's sister. But if that's not the case, it could be possible that they were conceived several days apart and one of them happened to be born a few days early or a few days late and just happened to be a coincidence that they both were born 20 minutes of each other.

Another thing I just realized. Nanase insistance on "nearly identical" seems to suggest that she might not have said anything to Edward about Susan awakening. Or maybe she did and Edward doesn't believe Tedd's theory that awakening can affect a person physically.

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3 hours ago, mlooney said:

It's a bit strange to me that DGB can't get at adoption papers.

Susan's check would have been pre-Abraham, Diane's check would have been like a month ago at most. 

Edwards access to documents has probably changed, and the adoption papers are probably harder to access anyway due to privacy laws. Plus there might not be anything there to link diane to Susan, as her mother might not have listed a father, or the right person when she gave Diane up. 

Though, I would laugh if Diane was the result of "accidental" cheating like "Sorry I got drunk and slept with your sister" cheating due to intoxication, and not an ongoing affair. He might not have even known about Diane if it was a 1 night stand. for all we know Mrs. Pompoms (and diane's mother) might have both been pregnant when Mrs. Pompoms married the father. 

Though I fully expect the other woman in susan's flashback was Diane's mother.

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57 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Hmm...so here's a thought, Diane and Susan were born 20 minutes apart, that suggests they were conceived on the same day 9 months earlier

You aren't a parent are you?  The estimated birth date the doctor gives you is the midpoint of a two week range, and there's probably a 25% chance the birth will be outside that window.  Being born on the same day doesn't guarantee you were conceived in the same *month* let alone the same day.

 

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If were not for the fact that he was married at the time, it could be a case like Grrl Power's back ground characters Tony and Olivia, where their dad "got lucky" with a set of twins.  Which means, really, the question we should be asking is "does Susan's mother have a twin sister?"  Asking that this be an identical twin might be pushing it however.

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6 hours ago, K^2 said:

It's not entirely uncommon for half-siblings to look strikingly similar.

Once we walked into a restaurant and immediately knew it was a family business, because I wondered if the greeters were identical triplets.

I mentioned that to our waitress. She was the mother of two of the girls - who were, in fact, identical twins.

The other "triplet" was her sister's kid. That's not as close a relationship as a half-sister.

2 hours ago, Scotty said:

Yeah, the background checks Edward's done on Tedd's friends were likely easy enough to do, Edward could have sneaked glances at Susan's record while looking for records of someone else that DGB was looking for or something. Or maybe some other excuse to go looking through records at any given time. Adoption records would be treated pretty much like top secret files where only certain people are allowed to retrieve them and you'd need a pretty darned good reason to look at them, like if a person was a possible terrorist or something. "I need to look at them because the person is a friend of my niece" wouldn't cut it.

Tracking everyone a serial cheater has had sex with would be difficult. It gets even more complicated if Diane's mother was also promiscuous - she may not have even known who the father was - or in a relationship at the time, so she didn't want to admit to having had some on the side and the father listed on Diane's birth certificate is not really the genetic father. And unrecognized, unacknowledged genetic relationships don't seem relevant to a background check for security purposes.

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A cheating cheater who cheated, eh?

Personally, I'm voting for Agent Wolf. He's got the brown hair, and it's entirely possible he and Cranium (who has the blonde hair) are the agents from the photo shown here (as I recall, they've never been officially identified though; please correct me if I'm wrong). If Wolf started as a covert agent, then the agency decided they can use him somewhere else, what better excuse to "fire" the overt agent and "rehire" him as a covert agent than a messy divorce because he cheated with a coworker (who they also want to turn into a covert operator)? Also, his facial expressions tend to be similar to those of both girls, he does resemble them as far as apparent facial structure goes, and he's intelligent enough (if overly obsessed with aliens).

I suppose another possiblility would be an immortal for a father, changing the one child into two children without the mother's knowledge, then putting whichever up for adoption. If that was the case, maybe there wouldn't be enough magic for the half-immortal's heritage to fully kick in, thus the father avoids a potential taboo that he doens't want to deal with later. (And what would happen if the two meet in that case? Magic tries making them one person again? O_o ) 

Meanwhile, who wants to be the one to tell Mr. Verres that birth certificats can be changed? ;)

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35 minutes ago, Kazzellin said:

A cheating cheater who cheated, eh?

Personally, I'm voting for Agent Wolf......

Conservation of detail is just a general policy for writers to follow, it's not a law handed down from on high.  There is Zero reason to think that Susan's father is any one we have "meet" yet.

Don't mind me, really, just the automatic assumption that way too many fans (and not just of the EGS) have that the cast of whatever they are fans of can't ever increase with out major changes happening to the whole universe of the item in question drives me up the freaking wall.

Snarl.  Grunt.  Snap. Bark, etc.

 

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2 hours ago, mlooney said:

...the automatic assumption that way too many fans (and not just of the EGS) have that the cast of whatever they are fans of can't ever increase with out major changes happening to the whole universe of the item in question drives me up the freaking wall.

So you would not be interested in my theory that since Elliot and Tedd were the only characters in the first EGS comic  online, they must be the only "real" characters in the comic and everyone else is just a figment of Elliot's or Tedd's imagination (or delusions)?

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3 hours ago, Kazzellin said:

A cheating cheater who cheated, eh?

Personally, I'm voting for Agent Wolf. He's got the brown hair, and it's entirely possible he and Cranium (who has the blonde hair) are the agents from the photo shown here (as I recall, they've never been officially identified though; please correct me if I'm wrong).

I can't say you're wrong, but Wolf looks and acts too young for me to find that plausible.

Of course, he is a wizard so he may be significantly older than he looks - and, unfortunately, being a wizard doesn't mean one is wise. (Even though the term pretty much literally means "too wise for one's own good".)

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