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Howitzer

NP: Friday, September 2, 2016

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9 minutes ago, Howitzer said:

http://www.egscomics.com/egsnp.php?id=507

Pandora isn't a fan of the obvious.

Well, obvious == boring. Obviously she's not fan.

But I'm glad she marks her anyway. There was no good reason not to, given how little alternatives she had, except pissing of readers. Granted, Pandora wanting to piss readers sort of make sense ...

 

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Just now, hkmaly said:

Well, obvious == boring. Obviously she's not fun.

Just because obvious can equal boring doesn't mean that it must.

Being able to turn into a catgirl seems like all kinds of fun.

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3 minutes ago, Howitzer said:
7 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Well, obvious == boring. Obviously she's not fun.

Just because obvious can equal boring doesn't mean that it must.

Being able to turn into a catgirl seems like all kinds of fun.

(The "fun" was typo.)

All kinds of fun for the person transforming. Not so funny for someone who just observes it ... just like in the previous twenty cases. Catalina Bobcat is unlikely to do anything else with her cat form than all the people before her with similar kind of spell ... or anything else than Tedd and Grace, who DO have cat form from TF gun.

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24 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

(The "fun" was typo.)

All kinds of fun for the person transforming. Not so funny for someone who just observes it ... just like in the previous twenty cases. Catalina Bobcat is unlikely to do anything else with her cat form than all the people before her with similar kind of spell ... or anything else than Tedd and Grace, who DO have cat form from TF gun.

Heck, Elliot hasn't used his catform in what, 10 months? Granted transforming to it was painful but now that he's apparently come to terms with the female forms, maybe the cat form was fixed (no pun intended) to not be painful?

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5 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Is anyone actually surprised at the idea of magic being a huge dork?  :-D

 

Dork pride!

Nope. And on that thought, Ashley and Elliot are both dorks, so it would have been the will of Magic to get them together, it wasn't just a coincidence that Elliot just had to morph at the time that Ashley went to talk to him about Susan. ;)

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That aside, I may as well mark her and cross my fingers for her eventually doing something reckless with the spell.

I'd say that's a given.

Okay, so maybe the latter example isn't exactly reckless, but it is impulsive and poorly thought out - two things that go along well with recklessness.

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23 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Is anyone actually surprised at the idea of magic being a huge dork?  :-D

Whenever it wants to be a dorky dork, I guess.

So, about her parents... :demonicduck:

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2 hours ago, Aura Guardian said:

... If Magic itself is a huge dork, that... that would explain everything.

If not every thing, at least a great deal of things.

1 hour ago, CritterKeeper said:

Is anyone actually surprised at the idea of magic being a huge dork?  :-D

 

Dork pride!

Nopppe, as Susan would say

Or would that be noooope?

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One time when I was at an amusement park, I went into a live show.  Mostly to get out of the sun for a while.  The performers were singing and dancing their way through the audience and one of them thrust a microphone at me.  I had to sing the next line of the refrain to "Three Little Fishies" (dit-tem dat-tem what-tem to be specific).

I did not want to do that, but I went into that show on my own and had no one to blame but myself.

Pandora went to the mall looking for someone she could mark.  The universe gave her such an obvious target that she was actually offended.  But now she doesn't have much choice in the matter.  Either she marks Catalina or gives up on the entire plan.

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2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Pandora went to the mall looking for someone she could mark.  The universe gave her such an obvious target that she was actually offended.  But now she doesn't have much choice in the matter.  Either she marks Catalina or gives up on the entire plan.

This probably says a lot about the rules not allowing her to mark younger kids, the people she's gone to in the mall are at least over 18 so she's going to be finding the majority of them to be driven more by hormones. If she was in an area with a lot of 8-12 year olds, she'd have more luck finding people that would want to transform into things and be likely to do so at any time.

As it is, I think Nanase and Susan are the only examples of Immortals giving under 18 kids magic. Heck I wouldn't be surprised if Pandora waited till Adrian was 18 before she started teaching him how to use magic.

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4 hours ago, Scotty said:

 I wouldn't be surprised if Pandora waited till Adrian was 18 before she started teaching him how to use magic.

I would be!  She'd just lost her beloved, she'd be quite scared of losing their son, too, and want to give him every defense she could!  Plus, a vaguely medieval timeframe really had no idea of eighteen being an age of majority.  Children were small people who had to do whatever work they were capable of.  It was quite common to get married much younger than eighteen, or to leave home to apprentice in a trade.  She'd probably started teaching him magic even before his father died.

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55 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

I would be!  She'd just lost her beloved, she'd be quite scared of losing their son, too, and want to give him every defense she could!  Plus, a vaguely medieval timeframe really had no idea of eighteen being an age of majority.  Children were small people who had to do whatever work they were capable of.  It was quite common to get married much younger than eighteen, or to leave home to apprentice in a trade.  She'd probably started teaching him magic even before his father died.

We know Adrian was learning to use a sword when he was young, Pandora might have opted to finish that training, get him physically able to defend himself first before moving on to teaching magic, she had 34 years before she was supposed to reset, initially she probably thought that was plenty of time to prepare Adrian, 18 might have also been an ideal age for teaching magic in general due to the mind being developed enough to understand it, any younger and they might have more difficulty controlling it. Anyway Pandora had every intention of working within the rules before she turned 200 but I imagine as the day drew closer she became more concerned that Adrian wouldn't be ready and eventually concluded that he wouldn't be able to survive on his own after she reset.

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21 hours ago, Scotty said:

Heck, Elliot hasn't used his catform in what, 10 months? Granted transforming to it was painful but now that he's apparently come to terms with the female forms, maybe the cat form was fixed (no pun intended) to not be painful?

I know I wouldn't be exactly eager to test that unless confirmed by the book. On the other hand, I would definitely ask Tedd if he can fix it, now when he (presumably) tell others he has talent for analyzing magic.

21 hours ago, Scotty said:

And on that thought, Ashley and Elliot are both dorks, so it would have been the will of Magic to get them together, it wasn't just a coincidence that Elliot just had to morph at the time that Ashley went to talk to him about Susan. ;)

I seriously hope magic can't be that precise in how it influences things.

20 hours ago, AFNB said:
Quote

That aside, I may as well mark her and cross my fingers for her eventually doing something reckless with the spell.

I'd say that's a given.

Okay, so maybe the latter example isn't exactly reckless, but it is impulsive and poorly thought out - two things that go along well with recklessness.

Well, she got better with her impulsiveness ... but, with the emphasis on eventually, yes.

11 hours ago, Scotty said:
14 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Pandora went to the mall looking for someone she could mark.  The universe gave her such an obvious target that she was actually offended.  But now she doesn't have much choice in the matter.  Either she marks Catalina or gives up on the entire plan.

This probably says a lot about the rules not allowing her to mark younger kids, the people she's gone to in the mall are at least over 18 so she's going to be finding the majority of them to be driven more by hormones. If she was in an area with a lot of 8-12 year olds, she'd have more luck finding people that would want to transform into things and be likely to do so at any time.

As it is, I think Nanase and Susan are the only examples of Immortals giving under 18 kids magic. Heck I wouldn't be surprised if Pandora waited till Adrian was 18 before she started teaching him how to use magic.

There probably is rule against marking younger kids, but the rule likely ISN'T using 18 as a limit. First, it wouldn't make sense considering how old the rule is, second, if Helena and Demetrius broke such rule Jerry would say so.

It is possible the limit is based on TRADITIONAL limits for adulthood, which were basically something like "as soon as the girl is menstruating" and "as soon as the boy can lift the sword". In numbers, 12-14. SOME immortals might follow the raising of "adulthood" age a bit, but Pandora is unlikely to be one of them, based on her age.

Of course, this limit will STILL prevent her marking kids in the age of most fantasy.

4 hours ago, Scotty said:

18 might have also been an ideal age for teaching magic in general due to the mind being developed enough to understand it, any younger and they might have more difficulty controlling it.

Again, I would assume she started earlier, although it's the good explanation for her not starting immediately.

5 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Plus, a vaguely medieval timeframe really had no idea of eighteen being an age of majority.  Children were small people who had to do whatever work they were capable of.  It was quite common to get married much younger than eighteen, or to leave home to apprentice in a trade.

Exactly.

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10 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

I seriously hope magic can't be that precise in how it influences things.

And trolling Ellen by giving her a blonde hair when she was expecting black hair for burning out isn't precise?

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8 minutes ago, Scotty said:
20 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

I seriously hope magic can't be that precise in how it influences things.

And trolling Ellen by giving her a blonde hair when she was expecting black hair for burning out isn't precise?

No. Either everyone with her hair color will get blonde, or everyone expecting black will get blonde. Similarly, Nanase getting her magic back wasn't really targeted - anyone in her situation would get magic back.

But getting Ashley and Elliot together seems very hard to base on some general rule. Unless, instead of it being master plan starting with making Elliot think he don't need to transform again at night, the only thing which happened was "if someone is hiding something, the dork who would like it would be around just in time to see it", or something even more general.

... actually, it MAY be something more general, like "attempts to hide accidental transformations will fail more often than they should". But then it's not targeted at Ashley and it was still coincidence she wanted to warn him about bad Tom.

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On 9/3/2016 at 10:12 PM, mlooney said:

Nopppe, as Susan would say

Or would that be noooope?

Definitely the latter. Just try drawing out the P sound. It can't be done.

(You can't draw out silent letters either, so it isn't "noooopeeeee" - that's when you have a serious problem with your urinary tract.)

16 hours ago, Scotty said:

Heck I wouldn't be surprised if Pandora waited till Adrian was 18 before she started teaching him how to use magic.

10 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

I would be!  She'd just lost her beloved, she'd be quite scared of losing their son, too, and want to give him every defense she could!  Plus, a vaguely medieval timeframe really had no idea of eighteen being an age of majority.  Children were small people who had to do whatever work they were capable of.  It was quite common to get married much younger than eighteen, or to leave home to apprentice in a trade.  She'd probably started teaching him magic even before his father died.

Also, most humans don't have magic until they get a magic mark. Adrian, being half-immortal, might have started casting spells on his own while still in diapers. Training him in magic should have begun not later than the first known occasion when he did magic.

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19 hours ago, Scotty said:

This probably says a lot about the rules not allowing her to mark younger kids, the people she's gone to in the mall are at least over 18 so she's going to be finding the majority of them to be driven more by hormones. If she was in an area with a lot of 8-12 year olds, she'd have more luck finding people that would want to transform into things and be likely to do so at any time.

I doubt there would be a hard rule on not marking younger kids. Pandora has noted that she can mark anyone, as long as they have the power to use the mark. If she can't mark young children, then it would be as a consequence of children not having as much magical potential, which given that personal magical energy seems to be in part biological, that's certainly possible, with their smaller bodies and such.

Or it could be the thin threads of Pandora's morality acting up again.

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1 hour ago, Drasvin said:

I doubt there would be a hard rule on not marking younger kids. Pandora has noted that she can mark anyone, as long as they have the power to use the mark.

Submitted for your approval.  Did Pandora mark Billy Mumy in Peaksville, Ohio?

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It's a goooooood life. :lol:

Anyway, yes, in the days before high school became a requirement for most non-menial jobs, people were mostly regarded as adults by the age of sixteen (though a few things such as voting age in Europe and America required twenty-one years).

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17 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Also, most humans don't have magic until they get a magic mark.

Not in the "almost everyone" sense. Majority seems likely, but depends on how active immortals are. Note that counterexamples includes Nanase (immortal involved but never marked), Elliot and Ellen (magic item) and probably Greg. And likely Noah, as the timeframe suggest Pandora didn't marked him and it doesn't seem Adrian Raven knows about any other immortal to ask. (Meanwhile, Noriko and Edward MIGHT've been marked by Pandora as part of Adrian's training.)

17 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Adrian, being half-immortal, might have started casting spells on his own while still in diapers. Training him in magic should have begun not later than the first known occasion when he did magic.

Unlikely. I think diapers were not used in middle age. Also, using magic, yes (some sort of innate elf magic, possibly including self-transformations), but actual spells IMHO no. His wizard ability will definitely need some time before being usable.

14 hours ago, Drasvin said:

I doubt there would be a hard rule on not marking younger kids. Pandora has noted that she can mark anyone, as long as they have the power to use the mark. If she can't mark young children, then it would be as a consequence of children not having as much magical potential, which given that personal magical energy seems to be in part biological, that's certainly possible, with their smaller bodies and such.

Or it could be the thin threads of Pandora's morality acting up again.

Hmmm ... you can also read that note as minimal age being one of things Pandora can override if needed. Still, that leaves the question of why Pandora isn't trying to mark children in age when they think more about their favourite shows than sex, if she can and if thinking about sex limits the options so much.

One option is certainly the magic energy - that certainly sets up SOME limit, but probably not so big.

And yes, morality, although I don't think that would be so big problem for Pandora. Not that she would be so evil, more like she wouldn't consider giving spells to kid evil (possibly with exception of destructive spells).

 

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