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Zorua

Things You Only Noticed On Reread

411 posts in this topic

13 hours ago, malloyd said:

How often have you looked at a kid, thought (s)he had the wrong genetic looks, and asked about it?

2Q==

I don't know, but it's never happened with me and my son. Never.

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2 hours ago, Scotty said:

...there isn't really anything that stands out for Tedd that says "I'm Edward's son"

Tedd's nose resembles that of his cousin which presumably means that he takes after his mother in that feature.

We have rarely seen Edward without glasses, so it is difficult to really compare his eyes with Tedd's.

Growing facial hair can be a cheap and dirty way to make a man look more masculine.  So perhaps without the moustache Edward looks more like his son.

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I've always imagined Noriko's hair as red. Her red + Edward's blue = Tedd's purple. Just a thought.

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25 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Tedd's nose resembles that of his cousin which presumably means that he takes after his mother in that feature.

We have rarely seen Edward without glasses, so it is difficult to really compare his eyes with Tedd's.

Growing facial hair can be a cheap and dirty way to make a man look more masculine.  So perhaps without the moustache Edward looks more like his son.

True, as it is though the best example we've had of Nanase and Tedd's resemblance was during the Hair storyline after Tedd had used the watch to shorten his hair. And while it's true that we haven't seen Edward without glasses, Tedd's eyes, while maybe not as slanted as Nanase's, are still oval shaped it would seem Tedd gets his androgynous appearance from his mother.

My brother used to always be compared with our cousin on my mom's side of the family, despite being like 15 years age difference and the fact that our cousin is female. Meanwhile, on my dad's side of the family, if you were to look at my grandmother, her youngest daughter (my aunt) and my aunt's daughter, you'd think you were looking at the exact same person at different points of her life.

Just now, ProfessorTomoe said:

I've always imagined Noriko's hair as red. Her red + Edward's blue = Tedd's purple. Just a thought.

I thought about that as well, but I wasn't sure if anyone would call me out saying that's not how genetics works. I mean it makes total sense from an EGS standpoint in that Dan would have wanted to make it clear that Tedd was Edward and Noriko's offspring, Nanase being a natural redhead would suggest that red hair runs in the family, Although this sketchbook, if you disregard the gender bending, show's Nanase's dad being a redhead... so I dunno.

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Sometimes a dominant allele will completely mask a more recessive allele, but it isn't always that simple:

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Incomplete_dominance.svg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominance_%28genetics%29#Co-dominance

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allele#Multiple_alleles

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epistasis

Anyway... if the blue pigment is from a different gene than the red pigment, or if they are alleles of the same gene but with incomplete or co-dominance, they may both be expressed to some extent, I believe.

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5 hours ago, Scotty said:

Considering how Tedd and Nanase look so much alike , there isn't really anything that stands out for Tedd that says "I'm Edward's son", it's possible that Noriko and Mama Kitsune's family line has some pretty strong genetics which is probably how their magic is passed down from generation to generation so Noriko's genes could likely be more dominant than Edwards at least in terms of appearance, Edward's genetics and Noriko's in terms of magic potential are likely a different story.

So as far as an answer to the question of looks? "That's apparently just how it is with my family"

The issue would be if Ellen was the birth mother and Manase was the father.  Looking like Nanase family would indicate IVF with Tedd as the source.

With Nanase as the birth mother and Male!Ellen as the father it would indicate IVF with Elliot as the source.

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Honestly, if a lesbian couple gets a kid, "who is the father" is already an awkward, "non of your busines"-type question. Who gives a shit if people just conclude that it may be Tedd after comparing looks? :P Are we worried that people will think Tedd had a thing with Ellen?

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9 minutes ago, Maplestrip said:

Honestly, if a lesbian couple gets a kid, "who is the father" is already an awkward, "non of your busines"-type question. Who gives a shit if people just conclude that it may be Tedd after comparing looks? :P Are we worried that people will think Tedd had a thing with Ellen?

Given that Ellen has said she thinks Tedd is sexy, that might be an issue.

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I am looking forward to a situation where most of the main 8 doesn't know how Ellen got pregnant and then see the baby :P

I'm pretty sure this is all just fanfiction, though ^_^;

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Considering the mythological science of EGS, I wouldn't be surprised if at least one of the offspring from a Main Eight member was actually delivered by a stork.

At the very least, that stork could deliver pickles to, and perform Groucho Marx impressions for, the expectant parents.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xLpEsMTyJ0E Edited by Pharaoh RutinTutin
Relevant detail added
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1 hour ago, Maplestrip said:

I am looking forward to a situation where most of the main 8 doesn't know how Ellen got pregnant and then see the baby :P

I'm pretty sure this is all just fanfiction, though ^_^;

I got a feeling that Ellen and Nanase would likely talk about it with at least one other person, Likely Tedd if they want to use the TFG. And I would think Ellen would mention it to Elliot as well, not to tease him, but probably a heart to heart talk especially if this happens in the near future (like within the next 2-3 years comic time that is) it'd be something like "I know you have hangups about pregnancy this young because of when mom had you, but this is something Nanase and I want"

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Yeah, I don't see them wanting to start having babies in the immediate future.  They'll likely both be heading to college, especially Nanase, and there's really no pressure to start early.  Unless, I suppose, Tedd were going to move away, the magic clog were fixed so the watches didn't work any more, and the Uryuoms and/or government were reclaiming the TFGs.

 

Hmm, if getting pregnant while sex-transformed makes the transformation permanent, I wonder what would happen if, say, a ninety-year-old Sarah got herself transformed back to her 18-year-old SARAH.BAK file, and then got pregnant?  I would assume she'd at least stay young long enough to safely give birth, but would it be permanent beyond that?  Until she was through nursing?  Would she still be ninety on the inside except for her reproductive tract?  Or do they have a way to live forever (barring accidents etc) as long as they keep having babies every few decades?  Even the guys, if Tedd really can cause permanent sex-changes, would be able to stay guys for all but nine months or so every renewal.

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51 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Hmm, if getting pregnant while sex-transformed makes the transformation permanent, I wonder what would happen if, say, a ninety-year-old Sarah got herself transformed back to her 18-year-old SARAH.BAK file, and then got pregnant?  I would assume she'd at least stay young long enough to safely give birth, but would it be permanent beyond that?  Until she was through nursing?  Would she still be ninety on the inside except for her reproductive tract?  Or do they have a way to live forever (barring accidents etc) as long as they keep having babies every few decades?  Even the guys, if Tedd really can cause permanent sex-changes, would be able to stay guys for all but nine months or so every renewal.

The permanency is only for as long as the person is pregnant, I wouldn't go so far as to say that, for a 30 day transformation, if the person got pregnant on day 10, carried for nine monthns, gave birth, then immediately transformed back to normal because they had gone well over the time limit of the transformation. It might resume it's normal effect after birth  and end after 20 more days, though it might also keep the countdown suspended a month or two longer to allow the person to recover from childbirth properly as well as to nurse the baby.

It's been stated in comic that the TFG increases longevity but it's unclear exactly how that's accomplished, if the default body doesn't keep track of how old it is during transformations it might be a case of being able to transform for 30 days, and when the effect wears off, you return to what you were before you transformed, meaning you never aged those 30 days. So, if you transform yourself 12 times in a year with the full time limit of the transformation, you may only age at most 5 days? If that's the case then you wouldn't need to worry about the pregnancy method.

As far as Tedd's spell, he can only permanently change his default form, when he uses it on others it's just an enchantment that follows the rules of duration and resistance, although if he does make a wand that can permanently change a person's default form, then that's another story.

Back on the TFG subject though, I wonder if using a clone form like say Sarah at 90 uses the one she made at 18, because it's essentially her form anyway, the transformation becomes permanent which would reset her biological clock back to 18 years old. That's something that technically shouldn't work considering the other forms on the TFG have time limits, unless of course those time limits are programmed in with the form and not an actual hard limit of the TFG. That would mean that the clone forms wouldn't have a limited duration on them and probably one could have it permanently as long as they don't actively resist the enchantment. But then Sarah would go back to her 90 year old form despite it having been 20 years since she used her 18 year old clone form backup.

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19 hours ago, Maplestrip said:

I am looking forward to a situation where most of the main 8 doesn't know how Ellen got pregnant and then see the baby :P

I'm pretty sure this is all just fanfiction, though ^_^;

would be worse if Nanase was the mom. current girlfriend glares at elliot and comments that they thought he and Nanase weren't a thing anymore.

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10 hours ago, InfiniteRemnant said:

would be worse if Nanase was the mom. current girlfriend glares at Elliot and comments that they thought he and Nanase weren't a thing anymore.

Ashley strikes me as smart enough to reach a correct or semi-correct conclusin in her own.  If she knows about the TFG, etc. then she'd figure out it was Ellen transformed.  If not, she'd "figure out" that Elliot only provided genetic material as a favor to his twin sister.  Either way, she doesn't strike me as the jealous type.

Oddly enough, if Susan were Elliot's current girlfriend, I can picture her getting jealous.  She'd figure out that it was irrational and try to keep it in check, but she's not very experienced, relationship-wise, and was raised to be suspicious of men and think the worst of them.  Her hackles going up at the possibility of Elliot being unfaithful would be in character, as long as she gets to be smart enough to figure out what's going on and that she shouldn't let that feeling drive her actions.

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33 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Oddly enough, if Susan were Elliot's current girlfriend, I can picture her getting jealous.  She'd figure out that it was irrational and try to keep it in check, but she's not very experienced, relationship-wise, and was raised to be suspicious of men and think the worst of them.  Her hackles going up at the possibility of Elliot being unfaithful would be in character, as long as she gets to be smart enough to figure out what's going on and that she shouldn't let that feeling drive her actions.

I'm not seeing that in Susan.  She knows about the TF gun and the fact that it can change your biological sex. 

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1 hour ago, mlooney said:
1 hour ago, CritterKeeper said:

Oddly enough, if Susan were Elliot's current girlfriend, I can picture her getting jealous.  She'd figure out that it was irrational and try to keep it in check, but she's not very experienced, relationship-wise, and was raised to be suspicious of men and think the worst of them.  Her hackles going up at the possibility of Elliot being unfaithful would be in character, as long as she gets to be smart enough to figure out what's going on and that she shouldn't let that feeling drive her actions.

I'm not seeing that in Susan.  She knows about the TF gun and the fact that it can change your biological sex. 

Also, I think if it came down to Ellen asking Elliot for a donation (for in vitro), Elliot would tell Ashley or Susan, for Critter's example, and they'd understand.

As far as DNA is concerned, Elliot and Ellen's should be completely identical aside from Ellen having 2 X chromosomes and Elliot with an X and Y. Although it would be funny if Ellen ever had a DNA test done and found that she has and X and Y instead of 2 Xs.

Another way either Ellen or Nanase could get pregnant is to induce parthenogenesis in the egg. Also, while I haven't been successful in finding out if it's possible or not, I want to say that they could inject some of Ellen's DNA into Nanase's egg (or vise versa) instead of needing sperm.

Lastly, and probably the easiest route Grace could make a Uryuom egg and only Ellen's and Nanase's DNA would go into it. Of course in order to keep up appearances until the egg hatched, Ellen or Nanase might have to pretend to be pregnant using a watch or something, and then Edward would have to do up all the proper documents.

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2 hours ago, mlooney said:

I'm not seeing that in Susan.  She knows about the TF gun and the fact that it can change your biological sex. 

Didn't I say she would know it was irrational?  Sometimes feelings happen, whether they're logical or not, and I can definitely see Susan recognizing such feelings are happening, and consciously working to not let them affect her actions.

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19 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Didn't I say she would know it was irrational?  Sometimes feelings happen, whether they're logical or not, and I can definitely see Susan recognizing such feelings are happening, and consciously working to not let them affect her actions.

I think JML is saying that, because of the way the group is and the fact that Susan knows transformation tech and magic exists, she shouldn't have any feelings of jealousy in the first place. As I said before, if Elliot has to be involved as a sperm donor, he'd likely discuss it with whoever his girlfriend is at the time first and it's not like Elliot would need to have sex with Nanase to accomplish that. Though considering Susan likes to watch, she'd more likely be upset at missing out on a show. Actually I'm not entirely sure that sounds right, I mean yeah Susan was aroused by seeing Catalina kissing Elliot, but would that be enough to say that Susan would be interested in watching Elliot have sex too? On that note, is this slope getting too slippery?

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21 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Though considering Susan likes to watch, she'd more likely be upset at missing out on a show. Actually I'm not entirely sure that sounds right, I mean yeah Susan was aroused by seeing Catalina kissing Elliot, but would that be enough to say that Susan would be interested in watching Elliot have sex too? On that note, is this slope getting too slippery?

Ashley + Elliot + Susan as a passive partner is my #2 OTT.  (Number 1 being, of course Tedd+Grace+Sarah). I see no reason, if that is the case, that she wouldn't want to be a passive partner in a one off with Nanase.

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6 minutes ago, mlooney said:

Ashley + Elliot + Susan as a passive partner is my #2 OTT.  (Number 1 being, of course Tedd+Grace+Sarah). I see no reason, if that is the case, that she wouldn't want to be a passive partner in a one off with Nanase.

I don't disagree, but I still wonder if there is a threshold where Susan would go from being content with watching to "this is awkward".

This is certainly pure speculation seeing as Susan hasn't even had an opportunity beyond Catalina and Elliot to see if she has a limit to what she's willing to watch.

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On 6/18/2016 at 10:14 PM, Scotty said:

As far as DNA is concerned, Elliot and Ellen's should be completely identical aside from Ellen having 2 X chromosomes and Elliot with an X and Y. Although it would be funny if Ellen ever had a DNA test done and found that she has and X and Y instead of 2 Xs.

Ellen's proportions are a bit different though; larger breasts and such. Assuming the TF gun changes DNA, that aspect would probably be different in Ellen and Elliot as well. If the TF gun doesn't change DNA... Then Ellen would still have XY chromosomes? Hmm..

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4 hours ago, Maplestrip said:

Ellen's proportions are a bit different though; larger breasts and such. Assuming the TF gun changes DNA, that aspect would probably be different in Ellen and Elliot as well. If the TF gun doesn't change DNA... Then Ellen would still have XY chromosomes? Hmm..

Just did a quick search to see if it was possible for females to have XY chromosomes instead of XX. There is a genetic disorder called Swyer Syndrome that does this, but a couple of the main problems with this syndrome is that the ovaries never developed properly and most often become cancerous so they end up getting removed at an early age, also the person would need hormone replacement therapy during puberty to get the breasts and uterus growing. Females that have this syndrome apparently can still get pregnant if a donated fertilized egg or embryo is used.

If the TFG didn't modify the DNA, Ellen might be able to get away with saying she has Swyer Syndrome, although she would have fully functional ovaries because one of the TFG's purposes was to allow for populations to balance their male/female groups for reproduction, but she could still use that as an excuse if the baby her and Nanase had ended up looking like Ellen/Elliot and say that because she has Swyer Syndrome, Nanase donated the egg and Elliot donated the sperm because an egg from Ellen would likely have the same DNA as Elliot's sperm anyway.

Of course, when I referring to the TFG as applied to Ellen, I mean more about when Tedd zapped Elliot. I guess it should be noted that I am unsure whether the dewitchery diamond would have corrected any genetic oddity like changing XY to XX when it created Ellen or if all it did was create an exact duplicate of Elliot right down to the genetic level and not even know that there should be a genetic difference between males and females.

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