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Scotty

Story, Wednesday September 13, 2017

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16 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:
21 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Well she can't fit all of them. Might even actually only fit one.

Have you considered these possibilities?

  • Susan could use a larger purse.
  • Susan could use her backpack

The question was specifically about purse and I don't think Susan have multiple purses. Sure, she may decide to get full backpack of fairies for THIS meeting, but she will still only have one in purse.

16 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Remember that her fairies explode if she unsummons them instead of waiting for them to unsummon on their own, and it kind of seems that, like her sword, she summons them unconsciously sometimes. Also, how long to they persist now? Quite possibly they persist longer now. Taking them with her in some kind of bag strikes me as a better solution than leaving them at home where her mom could find them while she's gone, in her van in a parking lot, etc.

I don't think she summons multiple fairies unconsciously often. The sword was really exceptional case.

8 hours ago, Drasvin said:
16 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

This isn't actually relevant to your comment, but I wonder if Rhoda's magic could shrink fairies? A Barbie-sized fairie shrunk to 1/7 its normal height would be something like 4 cm or an inch-and-a-half tall.

Would be an interesting experiment, though it could end with unexpected results. Susan's fairies are already from the unexpected results that happen when you mix magic from two different people. Mixing in the magic of a third person might cause excessive weirdness. Though we won't know until it's done and weirdness isn't always bad.

Yup, definitely worth a try ... but carefully and with cover.

6 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:
6 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Maybe she has non-explosive early-unsummoning options as well.

I think not. Non-exploding fairies wouldn't be as entertaining. It would like putting seat belts on the bridge chairs in Star Trek and fixing them to the deck. When asked why that wasn't done, Gene Roddenberry replied that if he did that, the actors wouldn't fall out of their chairs.

Except Susan's reaction to exploding unsummoning was to NEVER UNSUMMON. There is no additional entertainment at that. I'm sure establishing the unsummoning of fairy make it explode by default was just because it was only way how to make Susan test something like that ... and she will need it later.

6 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

I could see that working either with them summoning to-scale versions of Susan's weapons or with Susan adding some plastic cocktail swords and boxcutters to her chest.

There is exactly ZERO reasons why adding cocktail swords wouldn't work. Of course, cocktail swords are not likely to be durable, while boxcutter would be too big to handle for fairy: personally I would choose big needle (sewing one, although I saw metal knitting needles which could also work) or nail.

4 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

And then put a shrunken fairy in Susan's box, have her summon a copy of it, and shrink that.

I'm pretty sure that putting something Susan summoned back to the box wouldn't allow it to be summoned even if not enchanted with anything else. Dan already fought hard to establish that repeating spells infinitely is not going to work with Ellen's spells.

 

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1 minute ago, hkmaly said:

I'm pretty sure that putting something Susan summoned back to the box wouldn't allow it to be summoned even if not enchanted with anything else. Dan already fought hard to establish that repeating spells infinitely is not going to work with Ellen's spells.

Yeah, even if Rhoda shrunk the fairy dolls themselves, the summoning spell might either not recognize that they're enchanted, or not recognize them as a usable item at all. Nanase's fairy dolls are created by magic, but they're persistent and are probably just mundane objects when not occupied by Nanase.

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5 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Yeah, even if Rhoda shrunk the fairy dolls themselves, the summoning spell might either not recognize that they're enchanted, or not recognize them as a usable item at all. Nanase's fairy dolls are created by magic, but they're persistent and are probably just mundane objects when not occupied by Nanase.

Actually, Rhoda shrinking the fairy dolls might work. It wouldn't NEED to but it could - and it would only allow ONE shrinking, not repeating the process.

And yes, Nanase's fairy dolls are persistent (although I wouldn't say mundane), Susan's are not.

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15 hours ago, hkmaly said:

There is exactly ZERO reasons why adding cocktail swords wouldn't work. Of course, cocktail swords are not likely to be durable, while boxcutter would be too big to handle for fairy: personally I would choose big needle (sewing one, although I saw metal knitting needles which could also work) or nail.

Remember, magically summoned weapons are only good for one blow anyway, so durability isn't as important.  The boxcutters were mentioned mostly in tribute to the 'Za Lord's Guard.  Those art-type blades with ergonomic pen-like handles might be a better size and weight for arming fairies the size of Susan's.  Letter openers also come in a variety of sizes and shapes.  If Susan's spell gets to the point where the fairies can summon things from the chest, I foresee a very fun trip to the dollar store and/or thrift store.  :-)

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11 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Remember, magically summoned weapons are only good for one blow anyway, so durability isn't as important.

Cocktail swords wouldn't endure even ONE blow and wouldn't be sharp. Of course are likely the only things fairy can actually wield as sword - the other ideas would be held more like polearm, specifically likely Glaive.

11 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Those art-type blades with ergonomic pen-like handles might be a better size and weight for arming fairies the size of Susan's.

Yes those might work.

11 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Letter openers also come in a variety of sizes and shapes.

I have letter opener which looks nice, dagger-like and is cold on touch which suggests it's actually metal. It's still barely sharp enough to cut the letter. I think that anything not actually designed to cut would do bad job cutting.

11 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

If Susan's spell gets to the point where the fairies can summon things from the chest, I foresee a very fun trip to the dollar store and/or thrift store.  :-)

Might be fun, especially if she wants something which looks nice.

However, if we want something mass-manufactured yet still extremely effective, although requiring harder to explain shopping ... surgical scalpel. Comes in variety of shapes, but mostly are designed to be hold in fingers and not whole hand, meaning their handles are not too big. And, obviously, are really sharp.

(Hmmm ... considering Susan somehow obtained real sword, I suppose she would be able to explain scalpel somehow.)

 

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7 hours ago, hkmaly said:

(Hmmm ... considering Susan somehow obtained real sword, I suppose she would be able to explain scalpel somehow.)

Having family with a lot of money would be a factor there, I suspect. It is amazing how the prospect of generous payment from a possibly repeat customer may smooth the 'awkward questions' part out of many deals.

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9 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Cocktail swords wouldn't endure even ONE blow and wouldn't be sharp. Of course are likely the only things fairy can actually wield as sword - the other ideas would be held more like polearm, specifically likely Glaive.

Aberrations are described as being especially vulnerable to magic weapons.  Use them as stabbing weapons instead of slashing, I'm betting they'd do some damage.  Maybe not as much as a regular sword, which could take one out in one blow even when wielded by an amateur, but cumulative damage would likely be a lot more than if a person were similarly attacked.

9 hours ago, hkmaly said:

I have letter opener which looks nice, dagger-like and is cold on touch which suggests it's actually metal. It's still barely sharp enough to cut the letter. I think that anything not actually designed to cut would do bad job cutting.

Dull things can be sharpened.  All you need is a good whetstone and some time.  Look at how many ways prisoners have found to create shivs.

9 hours ago, hkmaly said:

However, if we want something mass-manufactured yet still extremely effective, although requiring harder to explain shopping ... surgical scalpel. Comes in variety of shapes, but mostly are designed to be hold in fingers and not whole hand, meaning their handles are not too big. And, obviously, are really sharp.

I had a scalpel in fifth grade, as part of the kit for dissecting frogs.  They're still selling the same kits in the university bookstore, so I suspect they're still not hard to get ahold of.

9 hours ago, hkmaly said:

(Hmmm ... considering Susan somehow obtained real sword, I suppose she would be able to explain scalpel somehow.)

 

2 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

Having family with a lot of money would be a factor there, I suspect. It is amazing how the prospect of generous payment from a possibly repeat customer may smooth the 'awkward questions' part out of many deals.

You don't need a lot of money to get a sword, just a credit card number or paypal account and the internet.  When Highlander was at its peak, I remember there were a boatload of replica swords available from the official catalog.  Current TV shows and movies probably do the same, and there's also eBay and such for the ones not for sale any more.  I've even seen them show up in thrift shops from time to time!

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56 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

You don't need a lot of money to get a sword, just a credit card number or paypal account and the internet.  When Highlander was at its peak, I remember there were a boatload of replica swords available from the official catalog.  Current TV shows and movies probably do the same, and there's also eBay and such for the ones not for sale any more.  I've even seen them show up in thrift shops from time to time!

Swords obviously. I was thinking of scalpels and similar odd stuff of a specialised nature. I do not know how it works in the US but in Denmark at least sterilised medical supplies like scalpels are most readily available for clinics, veterinarians and hospitals. Some of it is even being kept track of such as sterile needles for syringes. (Not necessarily high security, just.. kept an eye on. The sort of stuff where money can buy the absence of awkward questions.)

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33 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Swords obviously. I was thinking of scalpels and similar odd stuff of a specialised nature. I do not know how it works in the US but in Denmark at least sterilised medical supplies like scalpels are most readily available for clinics, veterinarians and hospitals. Some of it is even being kept track of such as sterile needles for syringes. (Not necessarily high security, just.. kept an eye on. The sort of stuff where money can buy the absence of awkward questions.)

Easy to get.

See here, for example.

 

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35 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Well, in that case I am wrong and this stuff is easy to get in Denmark, too. Just order it from Amazon. The risk that they will open your package and inspect its contents is fairly small.

I can think of at least 2 reasonable jobs that having scalpels would be needed and not medical.   Taxidermist and professional model builder/painter.  As it happens I know some one who is both.

 

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1 hour ago, mlooney said:

I can think of at least 2 reasonable jobs that having scalpels would be needed and not medical.   Taxidermist and professional model builder/painter.  As it happens I know some one who is both.

Both of these would also be acceptable answers if someone did ask you what you wanted scalpels for. Sterile hypodermic needles for syringes, that one might take a little more work.

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1 minute ago, The Old Hack said:

Both of these would also be acceptable answers if someone did ask you what you wanted scalpels for. Sterile hypodermic needles for syringes, that one might take a little more work.

Depending on type of needle the model painter/builder would be OK.  How else do you put some of those things together?  Glue from a needle.  And paint, for very small spots, like eyes of 28 mm scale dudes.

 

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9 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Aberrations are described as being especially vulnerable to magic weapons.

I wonder if the explosion from Susan dismissing her fairies would count as a magic weapon. Homing Fairy grenades?

2 hours ago, mlooney said:
3 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

Both of these would also be acceptable answers if someone did ask you what you wanted scalpels for. Sterile hypodermic needles for syringes, that one might take a little more work.

Depending on type of needle the model painter/builder would be OK.  How else do you put some of those things together?  Glue from a needle.  And paint, for very small spots, like eyes of 28 mm scale dudes.

That would be tricky to do. You would have to be careful of what kind of glue/paint you use, or it'll clog up the needle.

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5 minutes ago, Drasvin said:

That would be tricky to do. You would have to be careful of what kind of glue/paint you use, or it'll clog up the needle.

The "only works on some plastics" stuff is watery thin, and assuming it never touches any thing made of the plastic it "welds" doesn't clog up.  Seen it used with the hypo you use for insulin.   The same guy was showing off with the eyes.  Painted them white with a brush, then used the needle to drop a spot of blue.  Used acrylic paint, which cleans up with water, assuming you get to it before it starts to harden.

 

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9 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:
Quote

I have letter opener which looks nice, dagger-like and is cold on touch which suggests it's actually metal. It's still barely sharp enough to cut the letter. I think that anything not actually designed to cut would do bad job cutting.

Dull things can be sharpened.  All you need is a good whetstone and some time.  Look at how many ways prisoners have found to create shivs.

I tried. I think that it depends on quality of the metal. Or I didn't "sharpen" through the paint yet.

9 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:
12 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

Having family with a lot of money would be a factor there, I suspect. It is amazing how the prospect of generous payment from a possibly repeat customer may smooth the 'awkward questions' part out of many deals.

You don't need a lot of money to get a sword, just a credit card number or paypal account and the internet.  When Highlander was at its peak, I remember there were a boatload of replica swords available from the official catalog.  Current TV shows and movies probably do the same, and there's also eBay and such for the ones not for sale any more.  I've even seen them show up in thrift shops from time to time!

Those replica swords would be prime case of something which is unlikely to be actually usable as weapon and I would expect Susan to know better - I mean, I know better and I'm not that experienced in weapon making. Wikipedia talks about materials, weight and balance and hilt construction.

Also note that I actually think Susan not only owns a sword, but was actually doing some training with swords, at least basics. Some fencing club or how it's called if they use real swords instead of foils.

8 hours ago, mlooney said:

See here, for example.

Right. Forgot we have internet and webshops rarely have "WTF are you needing this for" field on order form.

Note that those with replaceable blades wouldn't be good in traditional fight, but with the one-hit limit that shouldn't matter.

5 hours ago, mlooney said:

I can think of at least 2 reasonable jobs that having scalpels would be needed and not medical.   Taxidermist and professional model builder/painter.

Wait. Actually the model builder is fantastic excuse. The only difference between professional and amateur is how much money they are willing to use. I mean, Susan only needs one youtube video where scalpels are recommended for building models and fake interest in making one and even her mother is unlikely to find it weird, especially if it would be startrek models. (She's also unlikely to find weird if Susan fails to actually make the model. "Didn't expected it would be that hard.")

1 hour ago, Drasvin said:

I wonder if the explosion from Susan dismissing her fairies would count as a magic weapon. Homing Fairy grenades?

Based on meta, I would say yes. I mean, there must be some story reason why her fairies are exploding, and being usable against vampires is great one.

 

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1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Those replica swords would be prime case of something which is unlikely to be actually usable as weapon

Skallagrim begs to differ.

He has tested a great number of replica swords forged by modern blacksmiths, and some of these are pretty darn impressive. At one point he even demonstrated a bronze blade, which was surprisingly effective -- just not as durable as iron, obviously.

ETA: These are tatami mats rolled up he is slashing to pieces. They are not quite as easy to cut as he makes it look.

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18 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Skallagrim begs to differ.

He has tested a great number of replica swords forged by modern blacksmiths, and some of these are pretty darn impressive. At one point he even demonstrated a bronze blade, which was surprisingly effective -- just not as durable as iron, obviously.

Skallagrim might call them replica but both the name and starting shot refers to Albion Swords, who specifically directly on homepage says They are not look-alikes or replicas -- we call them re-creations because they not only look like period originals, but feel and perform like them as well, just as on the day that they were newly forged.

On the other hand I'm not insisting on the "replica" label. I'm just saying that anything which is bootload of just after major show with swords appears is more likely to be cheap mass-produced wall-hanger. (Cheap to make, not necessary to buy.)

Of course, real sword will cost more even without the "exactly like in movie X ©" label, until you count it per number of swings.

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1 minute ago, The Old Hack said:

Shya right.

Who?

1 minute ago, The Old Hack said:

Susan can afford to buy expensive swords.

YES. And she is also likely to already have experience with cheap stuff being more expensive in long run.

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1 minute ago, The Old Hack said:

Shya right. Susan can afford to buy expensive swords.

A battle ready modern sword costs around 300+ USD,.  Less than that and it's likely a wall hanger.

A good epee, on the other hand, cost $35 USD, and can be made into a fairly good point only rapier in a good afternoon's work with a file, or a few minutes with a grinder.

The difference, of course, is that a point only weapon,  only has to be stressed in  one direction, while a cut and thrust weapon has to be stressed in at least 2, and is designed to take an impact in such a way that the leverage of the attack will also be applied to the blade, which can, and will, cause a "wire tang" blade to snap at the hilt.

 

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15 minutes ago, mlooney said:

A battle ready modern sword costs around 300+ USD,.  Less than that and it's likely a wall hanger.

Found site which promises real swords for $150+. Well, and 'tactical' style blades under $50 but those really don't look like historical swords. The $250+ prices would be more likely, though. This $245 without sharpening $263 with looks real.

(EDIT: $150 here.)

15 minutes ago, mlooney said:

A good epee, on the other hand, cost $35 USD, and can be made into a fairly good point only rapier in a good afternoon's work with a file, or a few minutes with a grinder.

The difference, of course, is that a point only weapon,  only has to be stressed in  one direction, while a cut and thrust weapon has to be stressed in at least 2, and is designed to take an impact in such a way that the leverage of the attack will also be applied to the blade, which can, and will, cause a "wire tang" blade to snap at the hilt.

Most importantly, we already SAW how Susan's sword looks. Well, not exactly clearly but we know it's not rapier.

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14 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Most importantly, we already SAW how Susan's sword looks. Well, not exactly clearly but we know it's not rapier.

True, it's a classic long sword.  Cut and thrust weapon.

 

16 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

The $250+ prices would be more likely, though. This $245 without sharpening $263 with looks real.

I said "Around 300"   263 is around 300.   :P

 

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43 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

 

Of course, real sword will cost more even without the "exactly like in movie X ©" label, until you count it per number of swings.

Tang failures, mostly.  See my comment about leverage of the attack and the fact that it applies to both the sword AND the target...

 

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