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Stature

Story Friday December 15, 2017

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6 hours ago, mlooney said:

She never had a need to use a sword, just hammers, hence the lack of Western Martial Arts training.  And she would need WMA training, not fencing to learn to use a long sword.

Well she DID used axe previously, but for some reason opted for sword. And I'm sure fencing would be better than nothing - and easier to find.

5 hours ago, Scotty said:
6 hours ago, ProfessorTomoe said:

SHE'S TOUCHING HIM!

I think she's more worried about other things than holding someone else's hand.

He touched her, I think.

5 hours ago, Scotty said:

Also, did Adrian guess at Susan's awareness of him? Or did he already pass Diane who mentioned it? Grace was pretty vague about who saw him that day and I'm not sure if Adrian knows that Grace, Nanase, Ellen and Justin are friends with Susan.

Diane SHOULD be farther away from him. Perhaps he overheard them talking about it? Or he's just good at guessing.

5 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Susan is obviously good with hammers; much more practice. How long the sword will last in Adrian's hands is another question. Since the original idea was to arm Nanase, maybe one good hit. I kind of think Susan's hair is helping supercharge her sword now. I wouldn't be surprised if it stops glowing as soon as she hands it off

Yup, we don't know how well her upgrades work in case she lends the sword to someone else.

4 hours ago, Scotty said:
5 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Which brings to my mind something that Voltaire said: He told Ashley at the mall that she could walk right through him. Why would he do that? I don't doubt it was for his own perverse pleasure, but there might have been more behind it. If Immortals are supposed to only empower and guide humans, maybe physically restraining Ashley would have made Voltaire break the law and force him to reset. Jerry/Zeus may be under that restriction, or at least think he might be.

It makes sense, An Immortal can guide someone to go somewhere, but they can't physically move them against their will. Zeus would need to convince Diane to leave.

Agree, I would also expect this restriction is based on immortal law.

4 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:
4 hours ago, Tuscahoma said:

Also, why does Susan summon little Nase.  Why not little Susan?  She went to the trouble to make a Susan doll, but it seems like she is more used to summoning little Nase.  Or perhaps subconsciously she thinks of little Nase as a fighter since Nanase is.

Arguable. Possibly little Nase is the only fairy that explodes. But in his commentary Dan talks about Nase being an extra pair of eyes, so I kind of think that's what Dan has most in mind in this comic, at least.

I think all fairies Susan can common have the same abilities, but both the "more used to Nase" and "Nase is a fighter as Nanase" as subconscious reasons would make sense.

3 hours ago, Scotty said:

1) No one in Moperville trains in the usage of long swords, at best as some state, only Fencing, which isn't the same. Closest thing might be to join an SCA group but dunno how that would work.

Might be relevant.

3 hours ago, Scotty said:

3)She probably wanted to forget the whole vampire incident and didn't believe she'd ever have to deal with that sort of thing again, we know she didn't want to look at her spellbook after her awakening, she probably didn't want to use a sword until the goo fight. My guess is she kept swords in her summoning chest more as a deterrent if someone tried to mess with her.

4)She might not have wanted her mom to suspect anything happened to her in France, it'd probably be concerning if your daughter came back from a school trip requesting to take swordfighting classes, even if the excuse is that they were told about Joan of Arc.

She BOUGHT the sword (and not just one), which certainly required both money and time. She wouldn't be buying it if she didn't feared she will need it. And I'm not sure she kept it hidden from mom.

3 hours ago, Drasvin said:

Susan likely hasn't had sword training (or any formal martial training for that matter) due to the pain of the trauma she experienced in France. As Scotty pointed out, Susan didn't even want to look at her spellbook after awakening due to the pain and memories. She probably kept the swords and other weapons as a "better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it" type of precaution, but actually seeking out someone to teach her how to fight would have been more than she would be comfortable with. She might have been hoping powerful abilities and innate human instinct to be enough. It doesn't take a lot of skill to use a sword, it just takes a lot of skill to use a sword well.

Hmmm ... combined with "I've GOT to learn how to use a sword" ... maybe she planned to start fighting classes for same reason she bought the sword, BUT was putting it off due to the pain and memories ... and didn't get to it yet.

39 minutes ago, Kazzellin said:

Personally, I'm hoping the wide eyes Susan has right after Adrian speaks to her for the first time (in his true form) aren't because she recognizes his voice.

Might be just because someone answered to something she was saying to herself.

3 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

In a serious fight, even a couple of seconds or three can make all the difference. If Susan had had more experience with a blade, she could just have stabbed him in that moment he needed to recover. Sure, big dramatic swings like the one she beheaded the first aberration with look cool, but they take time and effort you can't always spare. In comparison a stab is faster to execute, won't bring your blade as far out of line and it may quite often be lethal in its own right.

Lethal for human. For vampire, the beheading might be necessary. On the other hand, stabbing would likely buy her time to do the beheading.

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2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

He touched her, I think.

I can't be certain because of the camera angle in the 6th panel, but it's possible that Adrian reached out his hand to offer to help her up, and she took it, in which case she touched him. I don't think Adrian would just grab Susan's hand.

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

She BOUGHT the sword (and not just one), which certainly required both money and time. She wouldn't be buying it if she didn't feared she will need it. And I'm not sure she kept it hidden from mom.

She also snuck several fairy dolls into the house recently. She might have been able to get a couple swords into the house without her mom knowing, and maybe her mom doesn't go snooping around her room when Susan's at school or work?

1 hour ago, Vorlonagent said:

I'm a little thrown off.  First Susan executes bearded snake vampire in one shot and now she can't use a sword?  She's owned one since before the second Goo incident too.  Plus the whole "hammer Queen" thing. 

Susan had momentum and the element of surprise for the bearded snake. That was lost when Koala/kangaroo guy dropped in, though she probably should have taken a slice at him immediately after throwing the hammer rather than taking a moment to resummon Nase.

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To those who think fencing training isn't relevant: fencing isn't only those flimsy whiplike foils. They also use a fairly substantial stabbing-sword ("épée") and a somewhat lighter cut-or-stab sword ("saber").

However, kendo - or the SCA - would probably be a better choice for an actual heavy sword. It looks like Susan's wielding a good-size two-handed sword there, and they do NOT use those in fencing.

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2 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

I'm a little thrown off.  First Susan executes bearded snake vampire in one shot and now she can't use a sword?  She's owned one since before the second Goo incident too.  Plus the whole "hammer Queen" thing. 

She got the drop on the bearded snake vampire and stunned it with Nase, winning with a combination of luck and decent tactics. But looking at how she's standing after beheading the snake, it looks like she did a wide, heavy backhanded swing. Gives a good amount of momentum to the swing, letting it do a significant amount of harm if it connects (and it's really impressive and flashy looking), but it leaves her open (honestly, if she hadn't killed the bearded snake, she wouldn't be able to bring the sword around to guard before it did her serious harm)  and can risk overextending, causing her to lose balance. With the Koala vampire, she attempted another wide, heavy swing. Unfortunately, that time she gave him too much time to recover from the stun, so she missed, overextended, and fell. The only scene of her fight against the French vampire was an overhead chop with an axe (To be fair, the vampire was on the ground in front of her, but an overhead swing is rather slow)

As for the "Hammer Queen," that might be why she's using the heavy swings like she is. She's more used to swinging a hammer, which lends itself very well to heavy swings. She's also more used to using them on people that are being offensive or insensitive, not actual combatants.

Taking all that into account, I wonder just what Susan hoped to accomplish with that sword in the Goo incident. Maybe she should invest in a warhammer or a sledgehammer.

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9 minutes ago, Drasvin said:

She got the drop on the bearded snake vampire and stunned it with Nase, winning with a combination of luck and decent tactics. But looking at how she's standing after beheading the snake, it looks like she did a wide, heavy backhanded swing. Gives a good amount of momentum to the swing, letting it do a significant amount of harm if it connects (and it's really impressive and flashy looking), but it leaves her open (honestly, if she hadn't killed the bearded snake, she wouldn't be able to bring the sword around to guard before it did her serious harm)  and can risk overextending, causing her to lose balance. With the Koala vampire, she attempted another wide, heavy swing. Unfortunately, that time she gave him too much time to recover from the stun, so she missed, overextended, and fell. The only scene of her fight against the French vampire was an overhead chop with an axe (To be fair, the vampire was on the ground in front of her, but an overhead swing is rather slow)

As for the "Hammer Queen," that might be why she's using the heavy swings like she is. She's more used to swinging a hammer, which lends itself very well to heavy swings. She's also more used to using them on people that are being offensive or insensitive, not actual combatants.

Taking all that into account, I wonder just what Susan hoped to accomplish with that sword in the Goo incident. Maybe she should invest in a warhammer or a sledgehammer.

...so what I hear you saying is Susan is skilled at hitting offensive, high school students who have little or no combat training but has trouble dealing with someone who knows what they are doing.  I can see the point but she also juggled three hammers and a lunchtray once.  Maybe hammers are really her thing.

I don't know how much good slashing goo I'd expect slashing goo would do but I'd be more wary of splashing it around...

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3 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

In a serious fight, even a couple of seconds or three can make all the difference. If Susan had had more experience with a blade, she could just have stabbed him in that moment he needed to recover. Sure, big dramatic swings like the one she beheaded the first aberration with look cool, but they take time and effort you can't always spare. In comparison a stab is faster to execute, won't bring your blade as far out of line and it may quite often be lethal in its own right.

Very true. This is assuming (as already metnioned) that a direct stab would kill one of these things, though. And yes, timing is everything - especially in combat.

3 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Might be just because someone answered to something she was saying to herself.

This is a good point. I certainly don't expect someone else to reply when I'm commenting on something to myself. :D 

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Only now it is established that they are on an upper floor. Those backgrounds from earlier? Crocks!
10 hours ago, Scotty said:

I think she's more worried about other things than holding someone else's hand.

She could. She will. Just see. Hopefully.

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14 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

The Burmese Pythons multiplying in Florida swamps are getting big enough to eat alligators. So, get ready for Pythoon.

Okay, that I was not expecting.  Tip of the hat to you, my good man.

4 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

In a serious fight, even a couple of seconds or three can make all the difference. If Susan had had more experience with a blade, she could just have stabbed him in that moment he needed to recover. Sure, big dramatic swings like the one she beheaded the first aberration with look cool, but they take time and effort you can't always spare. In comparison a stab is faster to execute, won't bring your blade as far out of line and it may quite often be lethal in its own right.

Do we know if Aberrations require beheading to die.  Seems like the three times we have seen an Aberration killed, they have been beheaded or, in the case of the Spider-guy, was split down the middle.  I ask because I wonder if a stab to a vital organ would be sufficient to kill one? 

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8 minutes ago, Tuscahoma said:
4 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

In a serious fight, even a couple of seconds or three can make all the difference. If Susan had had more experience with a blade, she could just have stabbed him in that moment he needed to recover. Sure, big dramatic swings like the one she beheaded the first aberration with look cool, but they take time and effort you can't always spare. In comparison a stab is faster to execute, won't bring your blade as far out of line and it may quite often be lethal in its own right.

Do we know if Aberrations require beheading to die.  Seems like the three times we have seen an Aberration killed, they have been beheaded or, in the case of the Spider-guy, was split down the middle.  I ask because I wonder if a stab to a vital organ would be sufficient to kill one? 

Even if a stab to a vital organ isn't fatal for an aberration, I imagine it would be unpleasant. A stab to the lung would make breathing more difficult, a stab to the stomach would make digesting things problematic. The problem with stabbing aberrations is that they might not necessarily have the same internal organs any more. For instance, I'm not sure Sirleck would have functional lungs. Aberrations sustain themselves on life energies so might not need those organs for their life sustaining reasons, though that would certainly vary from vampire to vampire.

 

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15 hours ago, Stature said:

"Later, Gator"? Really?

There was a novelty song in the 50s or 60s with an exchange of "See you later, alligator!" and "After a while, crocodile!"

11 hours ago, ProfessorTomoe said:

SHE'S TOUCHING HIM!

I think, after falling flat on her face, Susan would not reject a hand offered to help her up.  She'd reach for her hand sanitizer as soon as possible afterwards, but given the circumstances, as soon as possible may not be real soon....

11 hours ago, mlooney said:

She never had a need to use a sword, just hammers, hence the lack of Western Martial Arts training.  And she would need WMA training, not fencing to learn to use a long sword.

Such training is available in Chicagoland.

10 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

There's another factor here. Remember from back in Hammerchlorians that Susan has a couple of swords. Also a bat and a crowbar.

Bats can be very useful.  (Especially magically or technologically supercharged bats....)

Quote

That said, does anyone really think Jerry/Zeus is going to keep Diane from running toward Susan?

Diane is not a fighter.  She didn't hesitate to run for help and to get away during the Not-Tengu incident.  I don't think she'll charge into battle willy-nilly.

9 hours ago, Tuscahoma said:

Okay, Susan and Adrian meeting.  There are so many things about this scene that bring on the feels and deliver the bad-ass at once.

If it were almost anyone else in the cast, I would think that Susan was realizing how gorgeous Adrian looks inhis natural form.

9 hours ago, Tuscahoma said:

Or perhaps subconsciously she thinks of little Nase as a fighter since Nanase is.

I like this idea.  It is now my headcanon unless/until proven otherwise.

9 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Arguable. Possibly little Nase is the only fairy that explodes. But in his commentary Dan talks about Nase being an extra pair of eyes, so I kind of think that's what Dan has most in mind in this comic, at least.

We haven't seen anything to indicate that the fairies work in different ways.  We haven't necessarily seen anything to refute it, either, I suppose, but I feel like if that was the intent it would have come up sooner.

9 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

If we see little Nase using a fairy punch later, Susan's probably a full wizard now, able to learn other people's spells.

Ooh, hadn't thought about that being a reason for Susan basically learning Nanase's fairydoll spell, except with explosions instead of persistence.

 

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51 minutes ago, Drasvin said:

Even if a stab to a vital organ isn't fatal for an aberration, I imagine it would be unpleasant. A stab to the lung would make breathing more difficult, a stab to the stomach would make digesting things problematic. The problem with stabbing aberrations is that they might not necessarily have the same internal organs any more. For instance, I'm not sure Sirleck would have functional lungs. Aberrations sustain themselves on life energies so might not need those organs for their life sustaining reasons, though that would certainly vary from vampire to vampire.

 

While we didn't see the result, Susan could have hit that vampire square in the chest and it would have been enough.

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4 hours ago, Scotty said:
6 hours ago, hkmaly said:

She BOUGHT the sword (and not just one), which certainly required both money and time. She wouldn't be buying it if she didn't feared she will need it. And I'm not sure she kept it hidden from mom.

She also snuck several fairy dolls into the house recently. She might have been able to get a couple swords into the house without her mom knowing, and maybe her mom doesn't go snooping around her room when Susan's at school or work?

Swords are bigger than fairy dolls. But ok, maybe she did.

4 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

To those who think fencing training isn't relevant: fencing isn't only those flimsy whiplike foils. They also use a fairly substantial stabbing-sword ("épée") and a somewhat lighter cut-or-stab sword ("saber").

However, kendo - or the SCA - would probably be a better choice for an actual heavy sword. It looks like Susan's wielding a good-size two-handed sword there, and they do NOT use those in fencing.

Thanks for confirmation. And yes, kendo would be better choice, but there are probably more fencing classes than kendo classes in Moperville.

1 hour ago, Drasvin said:
2 hours ago, Tuscahoma said:

Do we know if Aberrations require beheading to die.  Seems like the three times we have seen an Aberration killed, they have been beheaded or, in the case of the Spider-guy, was split down the middle.  I ask because I wonder if a stab to a vital organ would be sufficient to kill one? 

Even if a stab to a vital organ isn't fatal for an aberration, I imagine it would be unpleasant. A stab to the lung would make breathing more difficult, a stab to the stomach would make digesting things problematic. The problem with stabbing aberrations is that they might not necessarily have the same internal organs any more. For instance, I'm not sure Sirleck would have functional lungs. Aberrations sustain themselves on life energies so might not need those organs for their life sustaining reasons, though that would certainly vary from vampire to vampire.

I'm pretty sure "vary from vampire to vampire" is going to be the main point. Some vampires likely are killable by stabbing, but beheading might be only way to be sure.

 

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6 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

However, kendo - or the SCA - would probably be a better choice for an actual heavy sword. It looks like Susan's wielding a good-size two-handed sword there, and they do NOT use those in fencing.

There is a Youtuber who calls himself Skallagrim who does some excellent videos on various weapons used through history as well as HEMA (Historical European Martial Arts). It is possible to learn a good deal from them; I recommend them highly. Some of them, as shown in the Ultimate Fighting Style I posted earlier, are more humorous than others.

3 hours ago, Drasvin said:

Even if a stab to a vital organ isn't fatal for an aberration, I imagine it would be unpleasant.

"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style."

8 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Lethal for human. For vampire, the beheading might be necessary.

It is possible, but remember that the aberrations refer to one of Susan's powers -- potential or actual -- as the Bane. For all we know, a well placed stab from it might be enough for it to do its work.

Then again, it might require her to pick them up, sling them across her shoulders and break their backs. But that seems a little roundabout to me. :danshiftyeyes:

 

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3 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Diane is not a fighter.  She didn't hesitate to run for help and to get away during the Not-Tengu incident.  I don't think she'll charge into battle willy-nilly.

In that instance, Diane had specific instructions to run TO. She was supposed to go find a spot where cell phones would work, and then call a specific person to come deal with the situation. That's a positive action which might have ended up saving her friends. (It didn't, but she couldn't know that until the incident was pretty much over.)

Here, all she is being told is to run FROM. No purpose other than saving herself.

Not even close to the same thing, for lots of people. What I've seen of Diane, she's probably one of them.

What she will think she can do to help, I won't guess. But I strongly suspect she'll try something.

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Just now, Don Edwards said:

What she will think she can do to help, I won't guess. But I strongly suspect she'll try something.

She is clever and intelligent. She might not be able to save the day with a well-aimed soccer ball, but I am sure she'll think of something.

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2 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

What she will think she can do to help, I won't guess. But I strongly suspect she'll try something.

She's already proven valuable as an extra pair of eyes. Certainly saved Susan's life.

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1 hour ago, Don Edwards said:

In that instance, Diane had specific instructions to run TO. She was supposed to go find a spot where cell phones would work, and then call a specific person to come deal with the situation. That's a positive action which might have ended up saving her friends. (It didn't, but she couldn't know that until the incident was pretty much over.)

And she probably still has that number in her cell.  I mean, would *you* delete it?  I wasn't thinking she'd just run away home and forget about Susan, but she won't charge into the fray immediately.  My guess would be, she'll call (or try to call) Mr. Verres's number first, and then try to keep out of the fighters' way while also trying to help out with shouts and soccer balls if and when they might be helpful.  The problem for her will come when one or more of the aberrations notice that's what she's doing....

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1 hour ago, Don Edwards said:

She was supposed to...call a specific person to come deal with the situation.

By the time she gets to the part where her history teacher is using a magic sword to fight monsters in the mall food court,  Edward will have the Governor calling in the National Guard.  And he will probably alert the President to have a tactical nuke standing by in case any of them seem to be getting away.

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3 hours ago, The Old Hack said:
7 hours ago, Drasvin said:

Even if a stab to a vital organ isn't fatal for an aberration, I imagine it would be unpleasant.

"No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style."

Wizards are traditionally vulnerable by physical combat, but the same is usually not true with non-human magic users like dragons. The r- ... t- ... Dragon Nobilis ones I mean.

2 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:
3 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

In that instance, Diane had specific instructions to run TO. She was supposed to go find a spot where cell phones would work, and then call a specific person to come deal with the situation. That's a positive action which might have ended up saving her friends. (It didn't, but she couldn't know that until the incident was pretty much over.)

And she probably still has that number in her cell.  I mean, would *you* delete it?  I wasn't thinking she'd just run away home and forget about Susan, but she won't charge into the fray immediately.  My guess would be, she'll call (or try to call) Mr. Verres's number first, and then try to keep out of the fighters' way while also trying to help out with shouts and soccer balls if and when they might be helpful.  The problem for her will come when one or more of the aberrations notice that's what she's doing....

As far as we (or HER) know, there is no phone jamming in operation now. She doesn't need to run to try to call.

2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:
3 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

She was supposed to...call a specific person to come deal with the situation.

By the time she gets to the part where her history teacher is using a magic sword to fight monsters in the mall food court,  Edward will have the Governor calling in the National Guard.  And he will probably alert the President to have a tactical nuke standing by in case any of them seem to be getting away.

Why? Edward KNOWS Adrian Raven. When Diane mentions that her history teacher is fighting vampire, Edward may consider the problem already solved.

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K^2    2
14 hours ago, Kazzellin said:

Personally, I'm hoping the wide eyes Susan has right after Adrian speaks to her for the first time (in his true form) aren't because she recognizes his voice. Thought that's mainly becuase I don't want him to be her jerk of a father.

She's looking at someone who moments ago looked to be in their sixties or seventies now looking barely older than she is. As much transformation as has been going around, that ought to take a moment to process. That this is Raven's actual form. The fact that he's an elf, and a dashing one at that, can only increase the duration of that necessary moment.

Besides, half-immortals cannot have children.

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3 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Why? Edward KNOWS Adrian Raven.

Exactly.  If Adrian is fighting monsters in public, Edward knows the situation is beyond urgent.

If Diane caught Adrian doing something sneaky in the background, Edward might think his old mentor had the situation in hand.

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12 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:
3 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Why? Edward KNOWS Adrian Raven.

Exactly.  If Adrian is fighting monsters in public, Edward knows the situation is beyond urgent.

If Diane caught Adrian doing something sneaky in the background, Edward might think his old mentor had the situation in hand.

I see where you are heading from, but disagree. It's not like you could blame Adrian on not keeping situation secret or like the monsters being in public would mean Adrian lost control over situation.

Also, informing Governor, National Guard and President would CERTAINLY make the situation worse (more public). Not speaking about the idea of throwing nuclear weapon in populated area of own state with expected causalities in millions just to destroy few vampires. IF it would actually destroy them.

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44 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Not speaking about the idea of throwing nuclear weapon in populated area of own state with expected causalities in millions just to destroy few vampires. IF it would actually destroy them.

This seems to be the 'helpful' reaction of many an overly trigger happy fictional high command. The Council in 'Avengers Assemble' that ordered a nuclear strike on New York City. In 'The Swarm', the US government's quite reasonable reaction when hearing of a swarm of killer bees on the loose is to order a full nuclear strike on Texas. In 'Monsters vs. Aliens', President Colbert almost orders a nuclear strike on San Francisco to stop a marauding alien robot.

Perhaps the nuclear strike against the alien UFO in 'Independence Day' was a bit better reasoned. Too bad it didn't work.

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Just now, K^2 said:
11 hours ago, Kazzellin said:

Personally, I'm hoping the wide eyes Susan has right after Adrian speaks to her for the first time (in his true form) aren't because she recognizes his voice. Thought that's mainly becuase I don't want him to be her jerk of a father.

She's looking at someone who moments ago looked to be in their sixties or seventies now looking barely older than she is. As much transformation as has been going around, that ought to take a moment to process. That this is Raven's actual form. The fact that he's an elf, and a dashing one at that, can only increase the duration of that necessary moment.

We have a side view of both of them in the last panel that shows just how much alike they look, aside from Adrian's ears of course. I think Susan sees that, as she had already felt he seemed familiar before, but I doubt she think he's her father. Even though there might have been at least decade since she last saw her father, I still think they should recognize each other as having lived under the same roof for several years. Even if Susan's memory isn't great, Adrian's should be, so I'd still say there's at least 1 other generation between them

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