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hkmaly

Story, Monday January 22, 2018

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http://www.egscomics.com/index.php?id=2450

Ok. The second purpose of seer is no big surprise: seers are supposed to help with planning the magic change and we still don't know how exactly.

Little surprise is how wordy the will of magic suddenly is.

Also, new info - only seers who have used magic are eligible ; this may further reduce number of seers who will be asked, in extreme case to one - because while Tedd is not only seer currently alive, he MIGHT be only seer who is using magic.

... not sure how it should prevent exploitation, however the "caught off guard and unprepared" definitely happened so it certainly reduces it ; and it might prevent OTHERS trying to influence the results directly (didn't stopped Voltaire trying to do it indirectly).

Also, still looking forward if Tedd will remember this or if he just would be aware of the new system without knowing how.

... wait; If the change is not severe, seers are NOT made aware?

BTW, Will of magic, one idea: seers would definitely be less confused if you try something else than disembodied voice - oh wait that might be deliberate.

(Do you also think this is like prerecorded and will of magic totally ignores what Tedd is saying until the recording gets to the point of asking question?)

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11 minutes ago, Aura Guardian said:

I suspect that if the changes are not severe, they won't be needed to teach others nearly as much. Probably more to do with how access is gained, or the like.

There may be changes which are not severe and still be something most magic users will need to be told. Like, since now, everything will work as before but you can only cast spells when wearing scarf. ... well, ok, in winter they might realize it themselves, but if it happens in summer ...

Of course, if the will of magic is going by what Tedd will tell it, we may end up with "everything will work as before except people get big bonus to basic magic resistance", which might be easy enough to realize.

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I think Tedd has finally accepted the idea that simply giving everyone magic would not make magic safe for everyone.
And that is probably a good thing. 

But more importantly, EGS is now old enough to drive.
Make sure you look both ways before crossing the information super highway.

Random thought.  Could Lord Tedd have been involved in a Magic reset in his reality?  If he was, did he chose the wrong path for magic?

Edited by Pharaoh RutinTutin
Useless Detail Added

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1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

http://www.egscomics.com/index.php?id=2450

... not sure how it should prevent exploitation, however the "caught off guard and unprepared" definitely happened so it certainly reduces it ; and it might prevent OTHERS trying to influence the results directly (didn't stopped Voltaire trying to do it indirectly).

Today's page definitely makes a lot of Voltaire's motivations clearer. He wanted Tedd to be in a state of despair/anger/hatred in order to change how Tedd would influence the Magic Reset. Voltaire may even have predicted that Pandora would intervene in tonight's attack (and break Immortal Law in a way that would get her forcibly Reset) to save Adrian. What Voltaire probably did NOT count on though was Pandora's final trick of reversing the connection between all Immortals to exterminate the majority of the planet's Aberrations at one fell swoop.

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Still in a better dreamscape than when the magic whale barged in.

Sixteen years. Not a lot of webcomics last this long. Still want the missing strips from the vault. :demonicduck:

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Hmm.

I had been wondering about the wisdom of building up all these cool sets of powers and then wiping them all out, but the way Tedd's role is being described, it may not be nearly so thorough...

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1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

But more importantly, EGS is now old enough to drive.

But can EGS get insurance?

28 minutes ago, ijuin said:

What Voltaire probably did NOT count on though was Pandora's final trick of reversing the connection between all Immortals to exterminate the majority of the planet's Aberrations at one fell swoop.

Or that Pandora was so powerful she could force him to take part in that extermination. And don't forget, I said plenty of other Immortals will be all for doing something special to him when they find out it was all his fault.

1 minute ago, WR...S said:

I had been wondering about the wisdom of building up all these cool sets of powers and then wiping them all out, but the way Tedd's role is being described, it may not be nearly so thorough...

Gee, kind of like all those older, cooler Magic: The Gathering cards you can't use in tournaments any more.

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1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

I think Tedd has finally accepted the idea that simply giving everyone magic would not make magic safe for everyone.

... and just when he accepted it, he can actually change it.

1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Random thought.  Could Lord Tedd have been involved in a Magic reset in his reality?  If he was, did he chose the wrong path for magic?

Wrong? He chose so well he became Lord! ... well, it might've been wrong for some people ...

56 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Today's page definitely makes a lot of Voltaire's motivations clearer. He wanted Tedd to be in a state of despair/anger/hatred in order to change how Tedd would influence the Magic Reset.

Which we already expected. Well at least I did. But nice to have it confirmed.

56 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Voltaire may even have predicted that Pandora would intervene in tonight's attack (and break Immortal Law in a way that would get her forcibly Reset) to save Adrian.

He set it up that way.

57 minutes ago, ijuin said:

What Voltaire probably did NOT count on though was Pandora's final trick of reversing the connection between all Immortals to exterminate the majority of the planet's Aberrations at one fell swoop.

That wouldn't change anything. At least not in how the magic reset will be done. What WILL make big difference, however, and what Voltaire didn't expected, was that Pandora visited Tedd and made him feel much better.

28 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Or that Pandora was so powerful she could force him to take part in that extermination. And don't forget, I said plenty of other Immortals will be all for doing something special to him when they find out it was all his fault.

IF. If they find out it was his fault and if they find him afterwards.

34 minutes ago, Stature said:

Still in a better dreamscape than when the magic whale barged in.

Nah, looks pretty same to me, only the whale is missing ... which makes it MORE confusing, with that disembodied voice, as I already said.

32 minutes ago, WR...S said:

I had been wondering about the wisdom of building up all these cool sets of powers and then wiping them all out, but the way Tedd's role is being described, it may not be nearly so thorough...

Looks that way - after describing how big deal magic reset can be, seems it was just worst case scenario.

29 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Gee, kind of like all those older, cooler Magic: The Gathering cards you can't use in tournaments any more.

You mean like Black Lotus?

 

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2 hours ago, ijuin said:

Today's page definitely makes a lot of Voltaire's motivations clearer. He wanted Tedd to be in a state of despair/anger/hatred in order to change how Tedd would influence the Magic Reset. Voltaire may even have predicted that Pandora would intervene in tonight's attack (and break Immortal Law in a way that would get her forcibly Reset) to save Adrian. What Voltaire probably did NOT count on though was Pandora's final trick of reversing the connection between all Immortals to exterminate the majority of the planet's Aberrations at one fell swoop.

He was probably counting on the incident being the tipping point, but not how massive the incident would be.

2 hours ago, Stature said:

Still in a better dreamscape than when the magic whale barged in.

Sixteen years. Not a lot of webcomics last this long. Still want the missing strips from the vault. :demonicduck:

What missing strips?

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4 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Random thought.  Could Lord Tedd have been involved in a Magic reset in his reality?  If he was, did he chose the wrong path for magic?

I thought of this too, ever since I figured out what the second purpose for a seer must be. It fits in with Voltaire's plans to traumatize him by killing Elliot, and with Tedd's own musings about Lord Tedd being what he would/could have become if not for the support of his friends (who until very recently consisted solely of Elliot).

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5 hours ago, hkmaly said:

That wouldn't change anything. At least not in how the magic reset will be done. What WILL make big difference, however, and what Voltaire didn't expected, was that Pandora visited Tedd and made him feel much better.

 

Tedd will probably be a mix of negative opinions about the magic change and positive reinforcement from Elliot and Pandora and may end up being irrational about whatever she says about this which may end up working in Voltaire's favour.

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11 minutes ago, Scotty said:

 

Tedd will probably be a mix of negative opinions about the magic change and positive reinforcement from Elliot and Pandora and may end up being irrational about whatever she says about this which may end up working in Voltaire's favour.

It's also possible Tedd could use this to achieve hers and Pandora's goal of giving magic to everyone. Magic may not want that, but as Elliot says, in the modern age where Magic can't be kept secret, it will have to compromise on it's desire to not be used by everyone.

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Just now, partner555 said:

It's also possible Tedd could use this to achieve hers and Pandora's goal of giving magic to everyone. Magic may not want that, but as Elliot says, in the modern age where Magic can't be kept secret, it will have to compromise on it's desire to not be used by everyone.

The other thing might be if Tedd were to learn what Pandora just did, she might decide that Immortals should be free of their Law because it's a stupid law that decided that protecting family was illegal, being free of that law seems to be Voltaire's main goal since he had stated contempt for it.

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3 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The other thing might be if Tedd were to learn what Pandora just did, she might decide that Immortals should be free of their Law because it's a stupid law that decided that protecting family was illegal, being free of that law seems to be Voltaire's main goal since he had stated contempt for it.

That same law also protected Elliot, forcing Voltaire to find convoluted means around it. There has got to be a way to modify it to allow Immortals greater freedom to protect the innocent without also giving them greater freedom to harm them that isn't outright getting rid of the law.

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Just now, partner555 said:

That same law also protected Elliot, forcing Voltaire to find convoluted means around it. There has got to be a way to modify it to allow Immortals greater freedom to protect the innocent without also giving them greater freedom to harm them that isn't outright getting rid of the law.

But if Tedd's not thinking rationally, then she might forget that part.

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12 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The other thing might be if Tedd were to learn what Pandora just did, she might decide that Immortals should be free of their Law because it's a stupid law that decided that protecting family was illegal, being free of that law seems to be Voltaire's main goal since he had stated contempt for it.

 

7 minutes ago, partner555 said:

That same law also protected Elliot, forcing Voltaire to find convoluted means around it. There has got to be a way to modify it to allow Immortals greater freedom to protect the innocent without also giving them greater freedom to harm them that isn't outright getting rid of the law.

Simplest way: make the Immortals mortal. They don't have to have special restrictions regarding humans if they are human.

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1 minute ago, Tom Sewell said:

 

Simplest way: make the Immortals mortal. They don't have to have special restrictions regarding humans if they are human.

What would that mean for Wizards, Seers, and people with Bloodline Affinities?

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What I had in mind were the Capital-I Immortals, that is, beings like Pandora who used to call themselves Fairies, but not other immortal beings like Heka. That is, if Heka is really immortal. Possibly he might just be holding an immortal office. Ever read any of Piers Anthony's Incarnations of Immortality series?

Essentially, Immortals would become human wizards. They might remain unaging, but they'd lose their excessive intelligence, memory, and power, the things that make them crazy and dangerous.

An attractive part of this option is that Pandora could come back and live as a more or less normal human, and not turn into a formless blob every time she takes a nap.

I hesitate to bet any cookies on this one, but I think it's an interesting alternative.

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6 hours ago, hkmaly said:

That wouldn't change anything. At least not in how the magic reset will be done. What WILL make big difference, however, and what Voltaire didn't expected, was that Pandora visited Tedd and made him feel much better.

This I think will be the main cause for Voltaire's plan failing.  Pandora filled Tedd in on her first purpose as a seer, but also let her know what else she could do as a Wandmaker, letting her know that she was a powerful wizard in her own way.  Then Pandora helped Tedd work through some of her issues with regards to her parents by explaining how a parent feels in trying to protect her son in a world with magic.  Tedd also reaffirmed that he had guidance, support and love from his friends, especially Elliot.

1 hour ago, partner555 said:

It's also possible Tedd could use this to achieve hers and Pandora's goal of giving magic to everyone. Magic may not want that, but as Elliot says, in the modern age where Magic can't be kept secret, it will have to compromise on it's desire to not be used by everyone.

True, Magic seems to want to be restricted to a small percentage of people, unlike say, Magus' world.  Given a modern world, Magic might simply make it harder to learn magic; so what if more people learn about the existence of magic if in order to learn it, you have to undergo rigorous training or only a select few people are even capable of having magic.

Tedd might ask for magic resistance to be increased for everyone, so that regular people can resist magic, but can be the recipients of spells if they are willing.  Thus if magic becomes more well-know but is harder to learn, the magic practitioners who can cast spells that are desirable could actually set up shop.  Just a thought.

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Yup, Pandora definitely also thinks higher magic resistance for all would be a good thing.  Here's hoping Tedd can convince the Will of Magic to see it from their point of view.

Hmm, suppose they made it opt-in instead of opt-out?  That is, everyone is naturally highly resistant to magic, so that spells only have an effect on someone if they actively choose to allow it to affect them?  That would make use of magic much rarer, and eliminate or greatly reduce manipulations such as Voltaire overwhelming Dex with surges of magic power, or Pandora giving people Marks willy-nilly.  It would backfire for Voltaire because he'd end up even less able to affect mortals than they started out.  And it would enforce a code of ethics which Dan seems to be a big supporter of, that Magic not be used on people without their permission.

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Magic having a code of ethics would be severely limiting from a writing perspective; it would make it exceptionally difficult to create effective villains.

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Ethics alone will not prevent villains.

It just means that the villains will need to achieve power according to the letter of the law and then ruthlessly use that moral code to achieve their own objectives while crushing any one or any thing that might challenge them or upset the status quo.

According to the voice in the comic, Magic does not fully understand mortal and physical life.  So, it choses some mortals to guide this decision.

Tedd may be good, intelligent, and honourable.  And Tedd has known the evil that can exist in mortal and magical beings.  But even Tedd's imagination is not limitless.  Tedd can encourage Magic to accept any number of limits and boundaries.  But someone will find a way around them.

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2 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Yup, Pandora definitely also thinks higher magic resistance for all would be a good thing.  Here's hoping Tedd can convince the Will of Magic to see it from their point of view.

Hmm, suppose they made it opt-in instead of opt-out?  That is, everyone is naturally highly resistant to magic, so that spells only have an effect on someone if they actively choose to allow it to affect them?  That would make use of magic much rarer, and eliminate or greatly reduce manipulations such as Voltaire overwhelming Dex with surges of magic power, or Pandora giving people Marks willy-nilly.  It would backfire for Voltaire because he'd end up even less able to affect mortals than they started out.  And it would enforce a code of ethics which Dan seems to be a big supporter of, that Magic not be used on people without their permission.

That would be fascinating; going further than increased magic resistance, but yeah, much safer than magic is now.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

Magic having a code of ethics would be severely limiting from a writing perspective; it would make it exceptionally difficult to create effective villains.

Now on the other side, villains could still exist, just harder to work around the magical code of ethics.  For example, how many people agree to licence agreements without reading all of the fine print, and believe me, some software license agreements are scary.  Duping people to initially accept spells with unexpected consequences would still be a thing.  Could they opt-out later after the spell is cast?  Could a spell affect the ability to opt-out once cast (thinking something mind-control-y perhaps)?  Also, spells could be cast on things that create physical effects that couldn't be avoided.  Being able to start fires, having claws or strength, etc.

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