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Scotty

Story, Wednesday January 24, 2018

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1 minute ago, hkmaly said:

If that would be true, he wouldn't even know his mother is monster hunter, much less threatened people with her.

Norko's monster hunting is kept from Tedd because Tedd is seen as emotionally fragile where his mother is concerned.  Van not having this problem doesn't mean his mom is around much or at all.  It just means he wasn't kept in the dark as Tedd was.. 

Van's presence also means that someone recognized that Van wasn't the dead-end Tedd was thought to be.  If Norko understood that Van had potential and didn't make any effort to make amends to Tedd, well that's another sin on the list she needs to answer for.  It's possible the Ed Verres interfered here, to keep Tedd from being further traumatized.

 

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11 minutes ago, Vorlonagent said:
21 minutes ago, hkmaly said:
47 minutes ago, Vorlonagent said:

The less-nice explanation is Van showed no more magical ability at birth than Tedd and Norko abandoned Van the same way she did Tedd.

If that would be true, he wouldn't even know his mother is monster hunter, much less threatened people with her.

Norko's monster hunting is kept from Tedd because Tedd is seen as emotionally fragile where his mother is concerned.  Van not having this problem doesn't mean his mom is around much or at all.  It just means he wasn't kept in the dark as Tedd was.. 

Van's presence also means that someone recognized that Van wasn't the dead-end Tedd was thought to be.  If Norko understood that Van had potential and didn't make any effort to make amends to Tedd, well that's another sin on the list she needs to answer for.  It's possible the Ed Verres interfered here, to keep Tedd from being further traumatized.

Look what I was replying to.

If Noriko abandoned Van the same way she did Tedd, it would mean she's not around AT ALL and didn't bothered telling him anything about magic. While technically possible his father decided to feed him stories about his mother, I don't think it would make him threaten people with her.

Also, I think that Noriko still thinks Tedd has no magic potential, because Edward didn't contacted her since Tedd started working on TF gun (and likely some time before that as well). Meanwhile, she either recognized Van's potential on first try (I like the theory she used less scary detection method) or she stayed long enough to notice later.

She may still not be around much, either for protection or simply because she's busy, but she definitely sees him more often than on Christmas. She also writes to Tedd every Christmas, but Edward is confiscating those letters exactly as he told her he will do. He may not read them himself. ... wait, I'm speculating again.

That reminds me, where is the line between speculating and writing fanfiction?

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2 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Look what I was replying to.

If Noriko abandoned Van the same way she did Tedd, it would mean she's not around AT ALL and didn't bothered telling him anything about magic. While technically possible his father decided to feed him stories about his mother, I don't think it would make him threaten people with her.

All Van needs is to have been told his mother can't be around because she's a big important monster hunter.  Van's obviously a bit panicked in the comic so naturally he's going to try to defend himself against these people he doesn't know with the most powerful threat he can think of: Mom.  Which would be independent of her involvement in Van's life.
 

6 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Also, I think that Noriko still thinks Tedd has no magic potential, because Edward didn't contacted her since Tedd started working on TF gun (and likely some time before that as well). Meanwhile, she either recognized Van's potential on first try (I like the theory she used less scary detection method) or she stayed long enough to notice later.

If Noriko understands that there's more to Van than a 0 spell-acquisition potential, she also has to understand the same could be true of Tedd.  That means she owes Tedd an apology at the very least.  But this hasn't happened.  So either Norko either hasn't cared to reconnect or she's been blocked by someone or some circumstances or some combination of those.
 

8 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

She may still not be around much, either for protection or simply because she's busy, but she definitely sees him more often than on Christmas. She also writes to Tedd every Christmas, but Edward is confiscating those letters exactly as he told her he will do. He may not read them himself. ... wait, I'm speculating again.

That reminds me, where is the line between speculating and writing fanfiction?

Fanfic requires more words.  :)

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2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

The what?

Oh

... well it doesn't match exactly, but still useful and maybe Illjwamh hand-counted people from that list. I'm going to copy that to wiki. With reference and attribution of course. Before it disappears again.

I counted from my own master copy, actually. And it doesn't match because I didn't count people without names, like "Sarah's fan with glasses" or "Random Crazy Person". I did, however, include the legendary Phill, who as we all know is not on the list.

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1 hour ago, Vorlonagent said:
1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

If Noriko abandoned Van the same way she did Tedd, it would mean she's not around AT ALL and didn't bothered telling him anything about magic. While technically possible his father decided to feed him stories about his mother, I don't think it would make him threaten people with her.

All Van needs is to have been told his mother can't be around because she's a big important monster hunter.  Van's obviously a bit panicked in the comic so naturally he's going to try to defend himself against these people he doesn't know with the most powerful threat he can think of: Mom.  Which would be independent of her involvement in Van's life.

... if you think so, we can't do anything better than agree to disagree.

1 hour ago, Vorlonagent said:
1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Also, I think that Noriko still thinks Tedd has no magic potential, because Edward didn't contacted her since Tedd started working on TF gun (and likely some time before that as well). Meanwhile, she either recognized Van's potential on first try (I like the theory she used less scary detection method) or she stayed long enough to notice later.

If Noriko understands that there's more to Van than a 0 spell-acquisition potential, she also has to understand the same could be true of Tedd.  That means she owes Tedd an apology at the very least.  But this hasn't happened.  So either Norko either hasn't cared to reconnect or she's been blocked by someone or some circumstances or some combination of those.

There is big difference: Tedd tested as having zero magic potential. Van tested to have big magic potential, just no spells. She might prefer spell caster, but wand maker is not so big disappointment. Also, her British husband might be more accepting to her career, so she might decided she would just try again with him. It's spell casting DAUGHTER she wants, after all. Edward? When she told him Tedd's worthless he kicked her out.

1 hour ago, Vorlonagent said:
1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

That reminds me, where is the line between speculating and writing fanfiction?

Fanfic requires more words.  :)

Good. I was being worried.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:
3 hours ago, hkmaly said:

... well it doesn't match exactly, but still useful and maybe Illjwamh hand-counted people from that list. I'm going to copy that to wiki. With reference and attribution of course. Before it disappears again.

I counted from my own master copy, actually. And it doesn't match because I didn't count people without names, like "Sarah's fan with glasses" or "Random Crazy Person". I did, however, include the legendary Phill, who as we all know is not on the list.

Is that "master copy" file or database?

Did you counted just humans or also Max, Tara and Zeus?

Why is Phill not on list?

 

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The master copy is a notebook in which I enter all data by hand, color-coded by year.

Every named character is counted.

The explanation for Phill is long and wordy, and in the counting thread somewhere. Not sure where, exactly.

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5 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

The master copy is a notebook in which I enter all data by hand, color-coded by year.

... you mean old-style dead-tree notebook? Whoa.

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3 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

... you mean old-style dead-tree notebook? Whoa.

Lol. It was originally a project just for myself. I'd been doing it for a while before I thought to put it up on the forums in case anyone else was interested.

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22 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

a project just for myself. I'd been doing it for a while before I thought to put it up on the forums in case anyone else was interested.

And in the process, you created a monster.

If Tedd really is "Stuck" as a female, it isn't necessarily a big deal.  He is only a few months from finishing High School.  The Uryuom tech in Tedd's lab can handle temporary disguises, so no need to explain transitions or establish new identities in the short term.  And starting at a new school would be a convenient way to establish a new identity out of town.

 If Van isn't Noriko's son, then Dan is going out of his way encouraging us to think that Van IS Noriko's son.  Just like Dan went overboard trying to make us think Susan and Diane were sisters.  This could go any number of ways.

Beyond letting Tedd know who Arthur is, Edward probably hasn't told Tedd much about Arthur that is particularly substantial or helpful at a time like this.  It is almost certain that Arthur knows more about Tedd than the other way around.

Wild guess, but could this be a telepathic simulated world where only the most disciplined minds can keep from blurting out every random thought?  Or even worse, the true answer to any question?

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4 hours ago, hkmaly said:

If he's tri-langual like Nanase, he might be using Mum JUST because he speaks English.

There's no guarantee that Noriko would have subjected her kids to learning other languages like Mama Kitsune did with Nanase and Akiko.

4 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

I thought about this.  there's a nice explanation and a not-nice one.   Both explanations assume Van's father is British and Van is being raised by his father.

The nice explanation is Van is being raised well away from Noriko's monster-hunting activities to prevent Van from being used in revenge attempts such as not-Tengue's in Moperville.

The less-nice explanation is Van showed no more magical ability at birth than Tedd and Norko abandoned Van the same way she did Tedd.

Considering Van knows about his mum being a monster hunter, it's probably safe to say she's still in his life. Still curious to know if she's aware of what Van is or at least knows that he'd be a wandmaker, like maybe if Tedd didn't resist the detection wand, Edward and Noriko might have learned something about what Tedd would be capable off, not the whole being a Seer bit but being able to make wands,  Pandora certainly made it sound like the wand would have said something if Tedd didn't resist it. If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

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Why, if Noriko lives in Europe (which, at least when that fact was established, included the UK), would Van call his mother "okaa-san" to third parties (which I don't think you actually do even in Japanese...), no matter whom he was raised by?  He might call her that at home, but he'd still be as much a product of his country of birth as Tedd and Nanase are.

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2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Beyond letting Tedd know who Arthur is, Edward probably hasn't told Tedd much about Arthur that is particularly substantial or helpful at a time like this.  It is almost certain that Arthur knows more about Tedd than the other way around.

However, Arthur might not REALIZE this girl is Tedd.

2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Wild guess, but could this be a telepathic simulated world where only the most disciplined minds can keep from blurting out every random thought?  Or even worse, the true answer to any question?

So far, Tedd managed to be quiet.

1 hour ago, Scotty said:

or at least knows that he'd be a wandmaker, like maybe if Tedd didn't resist the detection wand, Edward and Noriko might have learned something about what Tedd would be capable off, not the whole being a Seer bit but being able to make wands,  Pandora certainly made it sound like the wand would have said something if Tedd didn't resist it. If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

Seems very likely the wand would identify all Seers as wand makers. That includes Tedd, Van and Arthur Arthur.

1 hour ago, WR...S said:

Why, if Noriko lives in Europe (which, at least when that fact was established, included the UK)

UK will be included in Europe no matter how brexit will end up. Btexit is about European UNION, not Europe.

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6 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

I think you missed that "getting every Immortal on Earth to enter the material plane and cast a spell to kill all aberrations within several miles" part. I don't think Moperville encompasses the entire Earth.

But the source of that event was in Moperville, and I do not doubt that Magic is well aware of that fact.

Quote

Um, Canada is about the nearest place where "Mum" is in anything like common use, and the nearest Canada comes to Chicago is Windsor, Ontario, across the bridge from Detroit. That's not exactly close.

A Canadian accent isn't really all that different from an American one.  Many American do, however, have at least some trouble pinning down English vs Australian vs South African (possibly vs someone from elsewhere who is fluent ine English and was taught to speak it RP England-style well enough to not have an accent).

1 hour ago, Scotty said:

There's no guarantee that Noriko would have subjected her kids to learning other languages like Mama Kitsune did with Nanase and Akiko.

People who live in Europe do tend to be exposed to other languages a lot more often, of more varied types, and are more likely to know multiple languages.  Americans live in a similar-sized geographic area in which generally people all speak English, so there's much less opportunity and incentive to learn additonal languages.

Quote

If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

Good question!  Arthur Arthur didn't know he's a Seer, so the wand probably doesn't have that as a readout option.  Despite being Wizards, Seers can't cast their own spells, but they have a lot of magic energy and can make wands.  Is there an option for "wandmaker" in the scanner wand, yet they never realized there was a category of wandmaker that was distinct?  Or would it read "wizard" and leave everyone frustrated that the wizard can't cast spells?

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From Dan on Reddit:
Quote

If the most common theory about Van is true, then that makes more sense given heredity and being around users of magic, and it would just be Arthur and Tedd's connection that would be considered coincidental.

Less coincidental is a seer happening to wind up head of paranormal investigations. It's coincidental that he ever had enough exposure to magic to realize it existed, but once a seer wound up in that job, well... Being able to see things others can't and make wands is a big deal working in a place like that.

In any case, magic users are rare, or it wouldn't be that much of a secret. Or, rather, they're usually rare. Moperville's sort of gotten out of control, but we're talking about a rarity on a rarity on another rarity.

The next comic notes how many seers are most commonly eligible when magic changes. Spoiler warning, but three is significantly above average.

So for starters, Dan's skirting around the idea of Tedd and Van being related, so it could still go either way with that. Second, Arthur apparently learned pretty quick about Magic that that he could make wands and he obviously knew about Magic being able to change, but he didn't know about the importance of his abilities in relation to Magic changing, Maybe his family has a history of being wizards as well and passed along accounts of the last system change? I don't really see Arthur as just stumbling into a position in the Paranormal Division.

Thirdly, it would seem that whenever the WoM felt the need to change the system, one or at most 2 seers would have been eligible, and 3 this time around is was probably unheard of, then again we do know that it's possible for seers to become ineligible if they find out about the second purpose, there might be some cases where a seer learns about their abilities and the fact that magic changes and comes to the conclusion that they can affect how it changes, that might make the ineligible, or they would have been told such. Anyway point is, there could be any number of reasons why such a low number get into this meeting and it kinda makes sense if the WoM wants to get a pure opinion from them.

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1 hour ago, Scotty said:

Thirdly, it would seem that whenever the WoM felt the need to change the system, one or at most 2 seers would have been eligible, and 3 this time around is was probably unheard of

IMHO, the Will of Magic would prefer a small number. It's been said that a committee is a life form with three or more legs and no brain.

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14 hours ago, hkmaly said:

... if you think so, we can't do anything better than agree to disagree.

I'm good with that.

14 hours ago, hkmaly said:

There is big difference: Tedd tested as having zero magic potential. Van tested to have big magic potential, just no spells. She might prefer spell caster, but wand maker is not so big disappointment. Also, her British husband might be more accepting to her career, so she might decided she would just try again with him. It's spell casting DAUGHTER she wants, after all. Edward? When she told him Tedd's worthless he kicked her out.

Van is a Seer.  By everything we know about Seers, Van should have tested exactly like Tedd, unless there's grades of Seer-ness, and EGS doesn't seem to support that.  EXCEPT, Arthur Arthur's comment about just thinking he was a Wizard with a quirk suggest there might be Seers who also spellcast?  I dunno...

Anyway, the point is, Van's lack of spellcasting should be identical to Tedd's lack of spellcasting.  If Norko realizes Van is special, not damaged, she must then realize that Tedd could the same thing. 

12 hours ago, Scotty said:

There's no guarantee that Noriko would have subjected her kids to learning other languages like Mama Kitsune did with Nanase and Akiko.

But living in the EU, even the UK, is more than enough reason to become multilingual.

12 hours ago, Scotty said:

Considering Van knows about his mum being a monster hunter, it's probably safe to say she's still in his life. Still curious to know if she's aware of what Van is or at least knows that he'd be a wandmaker, like maybe if Tedd didn't resist the detection wand, Edward and Noriko might have learned something about what Tedd would be capable off, not the whole being a Seer bit but being able to make wands,  Pandora certainly made it sound like the wand would have said something if Tedd didn't resist it. If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

THIS is a good point I forgot about.  If Van was subjected to a magical potential detection process that wasn't frightening (and therefore reflexively resisted) then Noriko would have a reason to think Van is different from Tedd.

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On 1/24/2018 at 1:54 AM, ijuin said:

The last meeting between Noriko and Edward was allegedly when Tedd was three years old, so if Van is younger than fourteen, then he would not be Edward's child.

Where in canon does it say that? I'd appreciate not looking through more than 2400 comics if you can tell me which one to look in.

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9 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:
Quote

If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

Good question!  Arthur Arthur didn't know he's a Seer, so the wand probably doesn't have that as a readout option.  Despite being Wizards, Seers can't cast their own spells, but they have a lot of magic energy and can make wands.  Is there an option for "wandmaker" in the scanner wand, yet they never realized there was a category of wandmaker that was distinct?  Or would it read "wizard" and leave everyone frustrated that the wizard can't cast spells?

I would assume there IS readout for wandmaker.

6 hours ago, Scotty said:

From Dan on Reddit:

Link?

6 hours ago, Scotty said:

Second, Arthur apparently learned pretty quick about Magic that that he could make wands and he obviously knew about Magic being able to change, but he didn't know about the importance of his abilities in relation to Magic changing, Maybe his family has a history of being wizards as well and passed along accounts of the last system change? I don't really see Arthur as just stumbling into a position in the Paranormal Division.

I think he found he can make wands quite quickly. He probably only found about magic reset because he was researching archives for people with his abilities ... and only now he realized that his search was closer to answering his original question than he though. And he's only one who knows about reset because the book wouldn't be there if Voltaire didn't put it there.

6 hours ago, Scotty said:

Thirdly, it would seem that whenever the WoM felt the need to change the system, one or at most 2 seers would have been eligible, and 3 this time around is was probably unheard of, then again we do know that it's possible for seers to become ineligible if they find out about the second purpose, there might be some cases where a seer learns about their abilities and the fact that magic changes and comes to the conclusion that they can affect how it changes, that might make the ineligible, or they would have been told such. Anyway point is, there could be any number of reasons why such a low number get into this meeting and it kinda makes sense if the WoM wants to get a pure opinion from them.

I'm waiting for next page for that "unheard of", but apparently the number of seers who DID found about having magic but DIDNT found about seer's second purpose is usually very low. Also, might be that the total number of seers alive is dozen or less. And that complain about those three eligible seers being 83% white Caucasian males is totally valid.

4 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

IMHO, the Will of Magic would prefer a small number. It's been said that a committee is a life form with three or more legs and no brain.

Nevertheless, I would think the ideal number of seers would be (warning tvtropes link) 3.

4 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

Van is a Seer.  By everything we know about Seers, Van should have tested exactly like Tedd, unless there's grades of Seer-ness, and EGS doesn't seem to support that.  EXCEPT, Arthur Arthur's comment about just thinking he was a Wizard with a quirk suggest there might be Seers who also spellcast?  I dunno...

Sigh. No. Tedd only tested as false negative because he ACTIVELY RESISTED the wand because he was scared of it. That's not NORMAL for seers or anyone else. Arthur Arthur was probably tested in later age, when loud noises didn't scared him (age six might be ideal, unless you want the wand back). Van was probably tested with less noisy detector.

4 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

THIS is a good point I forgot about.  If Van was subjected to a magical potential detection process that wasn't frightening (and therefore reflexively resisted) then Noriko would have a reason to think Van is different from Tedd.

Exactly.

19 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:
On 1/24/2018 at 10:54 AM, ijuin said:

The last meeting between Noriko and Edward was allegedly when Tedd was three years old, so if Van is younger than fourteen, then he would not be Edward's child.

Where in canon does it say that? I'd appreciate not looking through more than 2400 comics if you can tell me which one to look in.

I second that question. I don't think we were given date of the divorce, much less when they last saw each other.

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6 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Link?

I guess I should have just tried the permalink option rather than give up and use the old copy/paste method when the embed option failed lol, I don't use Reddit much...

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19 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:
On ‎1‎/‎25‎/‎2018 at 0:19 AM, Scotty said:

Considering Van knows about his mum being a monster hunter, it's probably safe to say she's still in his life. Still curious to know if she's aware of what Van is or at least knows that he'd be a wandmaker, like maybe if Tedd didn't resist the detection wand, Edward and Noriko might have learned something about what Tedd would be capable off, not the whole being a Seer bit but being able to make wands,  Pandora certainly made it sound like the wand would have said something if Tedd didn't resist it. If Van didn't resist a scan (though it's assuming a scan was done) what would it have said?

THIS is a good point I forgot about.  If Van was subjected to a magical potential detection process that wasn't frightening (and therefore reflexively resisted) then Noriko would have a reason to think Van is different from Tedd.

Given that Edward still has the scary-noisy detection wand, then it likely belonged to him, so Noriko would have to either pick up a new detection wand, which might not be as scary sounding, or learn a detection spell, which would likely not make such a scary noise.

That got me thinking about whether or not Edward has a detection spell, before I remembered that he does, and why he would use the detection wand if he does. I also really want to see what kind of stuff is in Edward's spellbook.

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Just now, Drasvin said:

That got me thinking about whether or not Edward has a detection spell, before I remembered that he does, and why he would use the detection wand if he does. I also really want to see what kind of stuff is in Edward's spellbook.

Edward's detection spell probably only gives information about active enchantments, and wouldn't actually give any indication of someone's magic potential. The wand probably has several different spells or something which would include Edward's spell but used in tandem with other spells would create a more detailed report about the magic user.

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3 hours ago, Drasvin said:

Given that Edward still has the scary-noisy detection wand, then it likely belonged to him, so Noriko would have to either pick up a new detection wand, which might not be as scary sounding, or learn a detection spell, which would likely not make such a scary noise.

That's before we talk about Van's father, who is very likely a powerful magic user, if not wizard, in his own right.

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8 hours ago, Drasvin said:

Given that Edward still has the scary-noisy detection wand, then it likely belonged to him

I think it belongs to DGB. However, it may be standard issue, meaning multiple copies working the same.

8 hours ago, Drasvin said:

so Noriko would have to either pick up a new detection wand, which might not be as scary sounding, or learn a detection spell, which would likely not make such a scary noise.

... of course it's quite possible Noriko didn't take ANY DGB stuff with her.

5 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:
8 hours ago, Drasvin said:

or learn a detection spell, which would likely not make such a scary noise.

That's before we talk about Van's father, who is very likely a powerful magic user, if not wizard, in his own right.

Yup. Or, maybe she DID used the same scary wand, but took her some time before she got it, so the child was not so young and easily scared.

8 hours ago, Scotty said:

Edward's detection spell probably only gives information about active enchantments, and wouldn't actually give any indication of someone's magic potential. The wand probably has several different spells or something which would include Edward's spell but used in tandem with other spells would create a more detailed report about the magic user.

Why? The detection wand might easily NOT scan for active enchantments as that is not needed for detection of magic potential.

In short, those are two completely different spells.

 

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15 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Yup. Or, maybe she DID used the same scary wand, but took her some time before she got it, so the child was not so young and easily scared.

Ed Verres' magic potential wand is probably DGB issue built by Arthur Arthur simply because it's technological-looking and so few people besides Arthur are capable of making wands.  It's unlikely for a british magic user to have a DGB-issue wand, though I admit it is still definitely possible, depending on how tight-knit the paranormal community is. 

It's not impossible for Arthur to have been the only source of new wands and similar implements anywhere in the world for a while there.  We don't know who the two other Seers-who-have-used-magic-but-found-out-the-second-purpose-for-Seers out there are, how old they are or how connected to the rest of Earth's paranormal community they are.

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On 1/25/2018 at 0:30 AM, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Beyond letting Tedd know who Arthur is, Edward probably hasn't told Tedd much about Arthur that is particularly substantial or helpful at a time like this.  It is almost certain that Arthur knows more about Tedd than the other way around.

Edward did tell Tedd (and Elliot, Justin and Grace since they were there) that Arthur was his predecessor as head of the Paranormal Division, and that he was also the face people saw in media acting as an FBI consultant. Edward also implied that it was Arthur that taught him a lot of what he knows, so it can be assume that Tedd has an idea of the kind of person Arthur is based on her dad. But it is apparent that there are some things about Arthur that even Edward probably didn't know about, like there being an intelligence behind magic's existence with the ability to change it at will but then it was made obvious that even Arthur didn't know everything or else he wouldn't have been eligible for this meeting.

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