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The Old Hack

Story Wednesday January 31, 2018

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2 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I should stress, I do not consider Mr. Verres to be beyond redemption. However, it is all too possible for a parent to inflict harm on a child while never meaning to.

Nor do I expect any redemption to happen swiftly and easily. First, because that would be an insult, and second, because Dan is too good a storyteller to allow that to happen.

I will point out that the last time we saw Mama Kitsune, she didn't say anything homophobic about Nanase and Ellen's relationship. Mind you there was a 6 month time skip in which she could have realized what she was doing and accepted it, maybe even support it. Heck when Nanase and Ellen started going around solving mysteries and such it doesn't seem like Mama Kitsune tried to stop it or claim that Ellen's a bad influence or something, but then again Mama Kitsune knows what went down at the High School and knows that Nanase's become a strong magic user so maybe she's taken that into consideration. Anyway, Dan might be handling Edward in a similar manner, though it would be nice if there was actual closure rather than just having it fade away and I'm hoping that Tedd's recent show of asserting herself in front of Edward is a sign that closure is coming soon.

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9 hours ago, Scotty said:
11 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I should stress, I do not consider Mr. Verres to be beyond redemption. However, it is all too possible for a parent to inflict harm on a child while never meaning to.

Nor do I expect any redemption to happen swiftly and easily. First, because that would be an insult, and second, because Dan is too good a storyteller to allow that to happen.

I will point out that the last time we saw Mama Kitsune, she didn't say anything homophobic about Nanase and Ellen's relationship. Mind you there was a 6 month time skip in which she could have realized what she was doing and accepted it, maybe even support it. Heck when Nanase and Ellen started going around solving mysteries and such it doesn't seem like Mama Kitsune tried to stop it or claim that Ellen's a bad influence or something, but then again Mama Kitsune knows what went down at the High School and knows that Nanase's become a strong magic user so maybe she's taken that into consideration. Anyway, Dan might be handling Edward in a similar manner, though it would be nice if there was actual closure rather than just having it fade away and I'm hoping that Tedd's recent show of asserting herself in front of Edward is a sign that closure is coming soon.

I suspect Mrs. Kitsune still does not approve of Nanase and Ellen's relationship (and/or thinks it's a phase) but thought warning her of the danger of the reputation she was building was more important. Still, considering how much her homophobia was built up she's been remarkably tolerant.

I remember back when Mrs. Kitsune was first introduced and continuing until the climax of Sister II, many Bunnies thought that when Mrs. Kitsune found out about Nanase being lesbian Nanase would be thrown out of the house, or that there would at least be a big fight between them. A few Bunnies argued that everything we'd seen of Mrs. Kitsune was from Nanase's perspective, and she might actually accept Nanase's homosexuality, but the ones who expected conflict said that would be unrealistic and/or bad writing. I don't have a quote, but I seem to recall Tangent even saying Dan was a "better writer" than to not have a big fight between Nanase and her mother.

Dan may be a good writer, but his discomfort in seeing his characters unhappy often leads to him squandering potential drama and conflict, and one should never bet on him avoiding an easy resolution. (Actually, though, even if this is a "flaw" in his writing, I like it that way. It's nice to have a story written for adults where I know things will never get too bad for the main characters, and most of the problems they do have will turn out all right in the end.)

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10 minutes ago, ChronosCat said:

I don't have a quote, but I seem to recall Tangent even saying Dan was a "better writer" than to not have a big fight between Nanase and her mother.

Dan may be a good writer, but his discomfort in seeing his characters unhappy often leads to him squandering potential drama and conflict, and one should never bet on him avoiding an easy resolution. (Actually, though, even if this is a "flaw" in his writing, I like it that way. It's nice to have a story written for adults where I know things will never get too bad for the main characters, and most of the problems they do have will turn out all right in the end.)

I remember that argument. I felt it was particularly annoying because it stated that "Mother believes child's homosexuality is a 'phase' that will pass" is the same as "Mother accepts child's homosexuality and supports their way of living." These two are not the same. In fact, the former is rather like not accepting that your child is transgender, continually deadnaming them and being 'tolerant' of their 'foibles.'

Then, of course, we have examples of the 'easy resolution' between Justin and Melissa, Adrian and Pandora, the current tension between Tedd and Mr. Verres as well as Susan's continuing struggles with her father's adultery. Oh yeah, not to mention the 'easy resolution' between Mr. Verres and Adrian. It is obvious that Dan has no idea of character drama and writes in much the same way as Laurell K. Hamilton or Stephanie Meyer. Feh!

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2 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I remember that argument. I felt it was particularly annoying because it stated that "Mother believes child's homosexuality is a 'phase' that will pass" is the same as "Mother accepts child's homosexuality and supports their way of living." These two are not the same. In fact, the former is rather like not accepting that your child is transgender, continually deadnaming them and being 'tolerant' of their 'foibles.'

True, "tolerant" is not the same as accepting, but it's still a lot better than what a lot of the Bunnies were expecting before Mrs. Kitsune learned Nanase and Ellen were dating.

2 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

Then, of course, we have examples of the 'easy resolution' between Justin and Melissa, Adrian and Pandora, the current tension between Tedd and Mr. Verres as well as Susan's continuing struggles with her father's adultery. Oh yeah, not to mention the 'easy resolution' between Mr. Verres and Adrian. It is obvious that Dan has no idea of character drama and writes in much the same way as Laurell K. Hamilton or Stephanie Meyer. Feh!

The "resolution" between Justin and Melissa came as a surprise to me - I really didn't expect Dan to have the guts to say "they're never going to be friends again". Still, while I usually prefer a "happily ever after" resolution, in this case I thought it was actually more satisfying than if they had made up; there was just too much bad blood between them for by that point.

I expect that Adrian and Pandora would have made up if Pandora had lived longer; depending on how her Refresh goes, it may still not be too late.

The situation between Tedd and Mr. Verres is currently in roughly the same position as the one between Nanase and Mrs. Kitsune prior to Nanase coming out; only when Tedd and Mr. Verres actually discuss Tedd's genderfluidty will we know what Mr. Verres views are and how "easy" the resolution is. Similarly, many of the other conflicts you mentioned are merely simmering in the background at the moment.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that all conflicts in EGS end with everyone getting along perfectly, or that they happen quick in real-time. I'm just saying that once Dan's ready to resolve a conflict it tends to go quickly in-story, and things often turn out better for the characters than one might have expected things to in a lot of other writers' stories (or, depending on who you ask, in real life). (And also, "Dan's a good writer" is perhaps not the best evidence for why things are likely to go one way over another.)

 

Edited by ChronosCat
Forgot to address a few conflicts.

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1 minute ago, ChronosCat said:

True, "tolerant" is not the same as accepting, but it's still a lot better than what a lot of the Bunnies were expecting before Mrs. Kitsune learned Nanase and Ellen were dating.

...it is not tolerant. I placed it in quotation marks deliberately. It is denial, which is completely different. "Your identity is a delusion and you will get better." And yeah, a daily kick in the stomach is better than daily torture with red hot needles, but is it good?

3 minutes ago, ChronosCat said:

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that all conflicts in EGS end with everyone getting along perfectly, or that they happen quick in real-time.

Well, that was what quite a few posters back then did, Tangent most certainly included, and it got really, REALLY old.

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2 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

...it is not tolerant. I placed it in quotation marks deliberately. It is denial, which is completely different. "Your identity is a delusion and you will get better." And yeah, a daily kick in the stomach is better than daily torture with red hot needles, but is it good?

And I kept it in quotations deliberately.

12 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Well, that was what quite a few posters back then did, Tangent most certainly included, and it got really, REALLY old.

Sorry for dredging up the bad memories.

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3 hours ago, ChronosCat said:

I suspect Mrs. Kitsune still does not approve of Nanase and Ellen's relationship (and/or thinks it's a phase) but thought warning her of the danger of the reputation she was building was more important. Still, considering how much her homophobia was built up she's been remarkably tolerant.

Maybe it's just me, but when we saw Mrs. Kitsune first refer to Nanase and Ellen as a "phase", I kinda got the impression it was a deliberate distraction rather than a deeply held belief.  She had just been seen to know far more about Magic than she let on, and then she  went from stone-faced to deliberately getting all worked up and crying....it seemed like she was manipulative enough to know exactly what she was doing, and how Nanase would react.  Better Nanase be mad at her mother than dwell too much on certain things.

That perspective does make it easier for me to accept Mrs. Kitsune (who needs a first name, dangit!) being okay with Nanase continuing to be together with Ellen.

 

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Just now, The Old Hack said:

Then, of course, we have examples of the 'easy resolution' between Justin and Melissa, Adrian and Pandora, the current tension between Tedd and Mr. Verres as well as Susan's continuing struggles with her father's adultery. Oh yeah, not to mention the 'easy resolution' between Mr. Verres and Adrian. It is obvious that Dan has no idea of character drama and writes in much the same way as Laurell K. Hamilton or Stephanie Meyer. Feh!

I don't really see Justin and Melissa's situation as fully resolved though, they finally talked, she said she wouldn't bother him anymore, but after what happened previously it just dropped off there, they're not back being friends, they probably haven't really spoken since then and I feel saddened that it ended the way it did.

Adrian and Pandora's situations is also not really resolved yet, I dunno how it could be since Pandora's reset, but Adrian still doesn't know that Pandora wasn't involved in Noah almost getting killed, he's just learned he has a daughter and descendants and who knows what he'll think once the shock has worn off. Though all in all, this is one of those "estranged family member dies before person is able to reconcile with them" moments.

I also don't think I've seen any resolution between Edward and Adrian, the last time the two talked, Adrian had hoped that Edward help him deal with the boar, but while the conversation started civil, it quickly broke down once Adrian's opinion differed from Edward's and then Edward refused to acknowledge their past. We still don't know exactly what happened so long ago, we just know that it involved Noriko and lead to her leaving Edward, but the exact details are unknown and I'm hoping that now that Tedd knows about her mom and Adrian being her godfather, steps have been taken to hopefully shed more like on the subject and maybe even have a resolution.

Just now, CritterKeeper said:

Maybe it's just me, but when we saw Mrs. Kitsune first refer to Nanase and Ellen as a "phase", I kinda got the impression it was a deliberate distraction rather than a deeply held belief.  She had just been seen to know far more about Magic than she let on, and then she  went from stone-faced to deliberately getting all worked up and crying....it seemed like she was manipulative enough to know exactly what she was doing, and how Nanase would react.  Better Nanase be mad at her mother than dwell too much on certain things.

That perspective does make it easier for me to accept Mrs. Kitsune (who needs a first name, dangit!) being okay with Nanase continuing to be together with Ellen.

If it weren't for the fact that it's been hinted that Mama Kitsune's had a negative opinion of homosexuality as far back as when Nanase and Susan went on that trip to France, "I remember what you told told me about your mother..." had to be referring to a conversation during the France trip, possibly after Susan made the comment about Nanase being immune to the vampires charms before she might be gay. So I find it hard to believe she's be putting on that act for that long even before Nanase developed magic.

One other thing the makes me hopeful, is the conversation that Grace has with Elliot about Elliot earlier behavior and comments about Tedd transforming into a girl, Elliot may not have realized at the time, but as Grace points out, those comment were hurtful. And yeah, Grace also points out that there are people out there that would never change their opinion of things despite them being wrong about it, but one could still be hopeful that some people just don't understand but can learn to be better about it. I'd like to hold onto hope that Edward and Mama Kitsune fall into the category of people that don't understand but are able to learn.

 

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3 minutes ago, Scotty said:

I don't really see Justin and Melissa's situation as fully resolved though, they finally talked, she said she wouldn't bother him anymore, but after what happened previously it just dropped off there, they're not back being friends, they probably haven't really spoken since then and I feel saddened that it ended the way it did.

Adrian and Pandora's situations is also not really resolved yet, I dunno how it could be since Pandora's reset, but Adrian still doesn't know that Pandora wasn't involved in Noah almost getting killed, he's just learned he has a daughter and descendants and who knows what he'll think once the shock has worn off. Though all in all, this is one of those "estranged family member dies before person is able to reconcile with them" moments.

I also don't think I've seen any resolution between Edward and Adrian, the last time the two talked, Adrian had hoped that Edward help him deal with the boar, but while the conversation started civil, it quickly broke down once Adrian's opinion differed from Edward's and then Edward refused to acknowledge their past. We still don't know exactly what happened so long ago, we just know that it involved Noriko and lead to her leaving Edward, but the exact details are unknown and I'm hoping that now that Tedd knows about her mom and Adrian being her godfather, steps have been taken to hopefully shed more like on the subject and maybe even have a resolution.

See? So easily resolved, all of this! Dan doesn't want his characters to suffer through drama! :P

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Just now, The Old Hack said:

See? So easily resolved, all of this! Dan doesn't want his characters to suffer through drama! :P

Oh, I might have misunderstood what you were saying and thought you said they were resolved. My apologize but we do seem to be in agreement then.

Although I admit that I do think that Justin and Melissa could have resolved things without any drama. Both sides handled things badly by letting their feelings get in the way of thinking things through. And while I don't blame Justin or Melissa for reacting they way they did, if Justin thought about it, he should have expected Melissa to want to confide in someone considering she would have felt rejected and maybe even think that there might be something wrong with her if Justin didn't love her the way she loved him. That said Melissa's behaviour after Justin was outed didn't help matter and only added fuel to Justin's anger over being outed, Melissa was saying homophobic things to Justin but I doubt she would have said them if she never thought the two of them were going to be together as more than friends. So Melissa was still being fueled by thoughts of what could have been.

We saw the tipping point when Elliot heard the story from Noah and inadvertently gave his opinion to Justin, Justin felt betrayed and that angered him more. But then Ellen gave him a swift boot to the rear helped him realize just how much he was letting his anger get to him.

Now it wouldn't be fair to expect that Justin and Melissa could go back to the way things were before they went on that date, but even though that's what Melissa believed, Justin could have offered to at least try to start over rather than just cut things off.

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18 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Now it wouldn't be fair to expect that Justin and Melissa could go back to the way things were before they went on that date, but even though that's what Melissa believed, Justin could have offered to at least try to start over rather than just cut things off.

Justin owes Melissa exactly two things. And one of them is jack.

She may not have outed him maliciously, but she still outed him. And afterwards she stalked him obsessively for years. While I hope Justin will someday get fully over his anger, he damn well has the right to do so in his own time and as he himself heals. And even then he has no obligation whatsoever to 'start over.' He might forgive her all the way -- I hope he does -- but he does not have to do anything whatsoever he himself does not feel any urge to do.

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19 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

Justin owes Melissa exactly two things. And one of them is jack.

She may not have outed him maliciously, but she still outed him. And afterwards she stalked him obsessively for years. While I hope Justin will someday get fully over his anger, he damn well has the right to do so in his own time and as he himself heals. And even then he has no obligation whatsoever to 'start over.' He might forgive her all the way -- I hope he does -- but he does not have to do anything whatsoever he himself does not feel any urge to do.

I think you have mentioned the salient point here....as he himself heals.  I think that Justin's T-shirt had it right -- all that anger isn't good for Justin, and being able to let go of it will be a sign he's healing and growing again.  He doesn't owe it to Melissa, but he might just owe it to himself.

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Something that has been lost in time is that part of turning the other cheek was that by doing so you were presenting a way that the only way the other person could strike you was by shaming themselves. Turning the other cheek wasn't just an advacation of non-violence and forgiveness it was doing so in a manor that showed WHY the violence was destructive.

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33 minutes ago, animalia said:

Something that has been lost in time is that part of turning the other cheek was that by doing so you were presenting a way that the only way the other person could strike you was by shaming themselves. Turning the other cheek wasn't just an advacation of non-violence and forgiveness it was doing so in a manor that showed WHY the violence was destructive.

At times that is doable. Given that I am an objectionable old hack, my own preferred manner is not to turn the other cheek but to ideally use the other guy's momentum against them in a judo throw to send them flying. And if that turns out to not be enough, then to hit back with much more force than they used and ideally break the arm they used to hit me with.

Yeah, it may sound excessive to some, but what the hey, it worked against the Nazis.

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On 2/3/2018 at 8:34 PM, Scotty said:
On 2/3/2018 at 8:07 PM, CritterKeeper said:

Maybe it's just me, but when we saw Mrs. Kitsune first refer to Nanase and Ellen as a "phase", I kinda got the impression it was a deliberate distraction rather than a deeply held belief.  She had just been seen to know far more about Magic than she let on, and then she  went from stone-faced to deliberately getting all worked up and crying....it seemed like she was manipulative enough to know exactly what she was doing, and how Nanase would react.  Better Nanase be mad at her mother than dwell too much on certain things.

That perspective does make it easier for me to accept Mrs. Kitsune (who needs a first name, dangit!) being okay with Nanase continuing to be together with Ellen.

If it weren't for the fact that it's been hinted that Mama Kitsune's had a negative opinion of homosexuality as far back as when Nanase and Susan went on that trip to France, "I remember what you told told me about your mother..." had to be referring to a conversation during the France trip, possibly after Susan made the comment about Nanase being immune to the vampires charms before she might be gay. So I find it hard to believe she's be putting on that act for that long even before Nanase developed magic.

On 2/3/2018 at 4:31 PM, ChronosCat said:

I suspect Mrs. Kitsune still does not approve of Nanase and Ellen's relationship (and/or thinks it's a phase) but thought warning her of the danger of the reputation she was building was more important. Still, considering how much her homophobia was built up she's been remarkably tolerant.

Maybe Mrs. Kitsune doesn't have homophobia. She seems to place great emphasis on tradition. Relationship with Ellen isn't problem by itself, but she is likely afraid that Nanase won't have any children without husband, and no children means end of tradition. Maybe she stops seeing the problem after Nanase and Ellen explains being lesbian doesn't mean they can't have children.

On 2/1/2018 at 11:18 PM, ChronosCat said:
On 2/1/2018 at 9:59 PM, Douglas said:

If seers don't remember when they participate in these meetings, then how does anyone know about the second purpose of seers? People would just know that magic changes, without knowing anything about the decision process.

I'm guessing Immortals; one might have been in a seer's dreams when the seer was contacted by WoM; they might also have other mystical means of gathering information.

Alternately, at some point there was a Seer playing around with magic that allows you to better remember your dreams and/or uncover lost memories, and accidentally uncovered it.

While possible, seers remembering the consultation seems like more likely solution. They may not remember all details, but seems that they will remember it more clearly than standard dreams ...

On 2/1/2018 at 0:58 AM, animalia said:

How about THEORTICALLY having magic give everyone just ONE spell based on their personality but they can be VERY creative in how they use it. For example Elliot would probably be alot like Josuke in his Boy Scout like nature and kindness would probably give him the ability to reconstruct things. (He can't revive the dead) In theory this wouldn't allow alot of combat capabilities, in practice actuality Josuke gets incredibly creative in how he uses it. For example ge once used his ability to shatter concrete then restore it into a wall in front of him to block projectiles.

Limiting magic to single spell is not real limit, yes.

And given the flair for drama, I don't think magic would be willing to limit magic in any way which would make it more predictable.

On 1/31/2018 at 10:56 PM, wanderingmagus said:

More specific rules can be set up to limit great magics to those deemed "sane" and "moral" by the seers, preventing criminals and maniacs from causing too much damage.

Seers may not be sane and moral themselves, as hinted by Heka when he asked if Pandora thinks Tedd is sane and moral. And Will of Magic will have even worse understanding of what's moral and sane than Pandora.

And it's not like moral is universal, anyway. There is no universal good either, it's all subjective.

And didn't we already mentioned how is magic unlikely to empower rule lawyers? It's bad enough that rule lawyers are most powerful between fairies ...

 

 

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On 2/2/2018 at 8:39 PM, Don Edwards said:

"Heterosexual" and "homosexual" and the various clinical and slang synonyms thereof kind of fall apart when trying to deal with non-standard genders or non-cisgender individuals.

Tedd has, to my recollection, shown no romantic or sexual interest in males, regardless of Tedd's form. With the possible occasional exception of Grace when Grace is in a male form. So if Mr. V persists in seeing Tedd as male, that would be "straight". But I would prefer "gynosexual" because it isn't affected by whether Tedd is currently male, female, or indeterminate.

The point is Ed Verres has to realize Tedd is not cisgender straight.  Then things get clearer.

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2 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

The point is Ed Verres has to realize Tedd is not cisgender straight.  Then things get clearer.

I don't quite agree. I think the point is that Ed Verres has to realise that not being cisgender is not 'unhealthy' or 'a disease.'

Still, I suppose it could be worse. He could think that being gay or noncis was an abomination in the eyes of God. *sigh*

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16 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

I don't quite agree. I think the point is that Ed Verres has to realise that not being cisgender is not 'unhealthy' or 'a disease.'

Still, I suppose it could be worse. He could think that being gay or noncis was an abomination in the eyes of God. *sigh*

I admit there is enough latitude in Ed Verres' presentation that he could harbor a prejudice against being non-cis (or distorted perceptions of it), but I suggest there is also enough latitude where his actions don't require such attitudes.

While we know Tedd is genderfluid, we have no canon proof that Ed Verres does.  Tedd's actions might be more concerning if they were done by a cisgender child, not a genderfluid one. 

The counterpoint is that Tedd is maturing greatly every way else. 

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5 minutes ago, Vorlonagent said:

Tedd's actions might be more concerning if they were done by a cisgender child,

I admit I don't see how. *scratches head*

6 minutes ago, Vorlonagent said:

The counterpoint is that Tedd is maturing greatly every way else. 

Hm. As in he may presumably be considered more responsible for how he thinks and acts? While I agree that this is important, I still don't quite see your point.

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Just now, The Old Hack said:

I admit I don't see how. *scratches head*

General immaturity, withdrawing from the world rather than coming to terms with it.  Being a girl rather than dating one.  Again, all I am suggesting is "cause for concern".  Verres expresses disapproval but does not at any point attempt to stop the actions he disapproves of.

2 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Hm. As in he may presumably be considered more responsible for how he thinks and acts? While I agree that this is important, I still don't quite see your point.

If "immaturity" is the label applied to explain why a theoretical cisgender straight Tedd transforms himself, Tedd's maturity in other areas suggests this explanation might be incomplete or incorrect.

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Noriko (may have) left Tedd and Edward (in part) because that wand insisted Tedd was not magical (that is, "normal").
Despite his paranormal duties, following Noriko's departure, Edward attempted to give Tedd the most "normal" childhood possible.
And what everyone failed to realize, at least until recently, is that Tedd simply is not "Normal".

Edward is aware of Lord Tedd.  So he does know the potential bad side of what abnormality could mean for Tedd.
But at some point, Edward needs to realize that his Tedd is not Lord Tedd.  His Tedd is different.  Tedd simply is not "Normal".

By the way, how close is Moperville to Normal anyway?  That would probably not be the place to send this group for their undergraduate work.

 

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2 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

General immaturity, withdrawing from the world rather than coming to terms with it.  Being a girl rather than dating one.  Again, all I am suggesting is "cause for concern".  Verres expresses disapproval but does not at any point attempt to stop the actions he disapproves of.

Hm. I can see what you mean, but Tedd has gone way past these traits by now. He has had a girlfriend for quite a while now. He is more and more open to the world even when you take his occasional obsessions into science (or SCIENCE!) into account. This may be the explanation but if it is I hope Mr. Verres begins to show signs of noticing before long.

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2 hours ago, Vorlonagent said:

Tedd's actions might be more concerning if they were done by a cisgender child, not a genderfluid one. 

2 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I admit I don't see how. *scratches head*

Tedd himself suggested it to (presumed cis straight at the time) Elliot -- transform into a gorgeous woman in front of a mirror and, ah, at the least pose, possibly explore in other ways too.  Same reason many cis straight guys choose to play a female avatar in certain games, "I'd rather look at a sexy girl's butt on the screen than some dude's!"

1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

By the way, how close is Moperville to Normal anyway?  That would probably not be the place to send this group for their undergraduate work.

Google Maps says it's about 110 miles from Naperville to Bloomington-Normal.  That's two to two-and-a-half hours drive, depending on traffic.

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7 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

Hm. I can see what you mean, but Tedd has gone way past these traits by now. He has had a girlfriend for quite a while now. He is more and more open to the world even when you take his occasional obsessions into science (or SCIENCE!) into account. This may be the explanation but if it is I hope Mr. Verres begins to show signs of noticing before long.

Exactly.  Human do excel at seeing what they want to see.   But there's enough there to suggest to an alert Ed Verres that his assessment of Tedd might not be complete anymore.

7 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Tedd himself suggested it to (presumed cis straight at the time) Elliot -- transform into a gorgeous woman in front of a mirror and, ah, at the least pose, possibly explore in other ways too.  Same reason many cis straight guys choose to play a female avatar in certain games, "I'd rather look at a sexy girl's butt on the screen than some dude's!"

That would be me.  Over 70 City of heroes characters total, 70% of them female.  (I knew I had more female than male, but I didn't realize it was that much more till I did a census)

There are some guys for whom the concept of men playing female characters (and the reverse) grinds their mental gears.  My brother may have been/may be one of those.   He once looked at me funny after I finished playing a female toon and I came up with "whose butt would you rather look at?" on the spot without ever having read it anywhere.

16 minutes ago, CritterKeeper said:

Google Maps says it's about 110 miles from Naperville to Bloomington-Normal.  That's two to two-and-a-half hours drive, depending on traffic.

Maybe 2 1/2 hours the way YOU drive....  :)

Most CA freeway speeds tend to be 65 MPH.  If IL highways are standardized on 55, that changes things.

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