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Illjwamh

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By the way, I was not standing up for Trump. "Absolute immunity" is nonsense.

I'm just wondering where the objections where when prior Presidents did essentially the same thing.

Clinton, by the way, tried to take the position that because he was President, everything he'd ever done was immune to subpoena. He was facing subpoena relating to stuff he'd done well prior to being elected President, and his response was in effect "I'm President so I don't have to respond to that." (The courts informed him that he was mistaken.)

Trump's lawyers are at least restricting their ridiculous claim to people's activities while they were senior officials in the federal government.

And a less-broad claim of immunity might be reasonable, as it appears that the House actually has no specific claims of wrongdoing in federal agencies to be investigated - they are issuing subpoenas in hopes of finding something that justifies the subpoenas.

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2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

I'm just wondering where the objections where when prior Presidents did essentially the same thing.

When did prior Presidents this grotesquely undermine the Constitution?

And why do you call me to task for not criticising Clinton in your presence more than ten years before we met?

And when did we have a debate about President Obama where he had potentially violated the Constitution and where we gave him a free pass? I seem to specifically remember agreeing with you that governing by executive order was a bad idea. My 'defense' of him was that he had 'no choice', which even I could hear was thin. If the stipulation is that overriding Congress with executive orders is putting the President on Constitutionally shaky ground, Obama is not free of sin.

Also, name a President that made grotesque concessions to the Russians and other dictators and betrayed allies that I ever spoke approvingly of.

What made Trump's offense against the Kurds so egregious was not merely ending the alliance with them -- which could theoretically be defended if it had been considered policy -- but doing it unilaterally, without warning and leaving them in an extremely vulnerable position against the Turks and the Russians. Whatever Obama's other foreign policy failures, bad as they might have potentially been, none of them came even close to this. He also did not hand dictators a platform. He also did not own two expensive hotels in Istanbul that resulted in his motives being cloudy. Please note that it is not about whether Trump's motives are impure or not, the emoluments clause is there to ensure that the President's motives are not exposed to doubt in this way at all.

2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Clinton, by the way, tried to take the position that because he was President, everything he'd ever done was immune to subpoena. He was facing subpoena relating to stuff he'd done well prior to being elected President, and his response was in effect "I'm President so I don't have to respond to that." (The courts informed him that he was mistaken.)

And when they so informed him, he yielded. How curious that Trump and the Republican Party are completely ignoring this precedent. Especially since it was a precedent the Republican Party itself established.

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7 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I seem to specifically remember agreeing with you that governing by executive order was a bad idea.

(Small aside: I am currently reading a book by Rick Wilson in which he argues this very point. He posits that using EOs in place of lawmaking is a poor idea because 1) it may be undone easily by any subsequent president and 2) it weakens the legislative bodies in the long run by transferring too much power to the Executive, and I certainly admit that the current President is more than proving your and his point to my complete satisfaction.)

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On November 17 in History:
 
9 - Birth of future Roman emperor Vespasian. He will be the second in a row (and overall) whose name begins with V, but certainly not the last. Look, I'm trying my best here.
 
375 - Death of Emperor Valentinian I. See? What'd I tell ya? V guys all over the place.
 
794 - Japanese emperor Kanmu moves his capital from Nara to Heian, called Kyōto today (literally "capital city", which of course it no longer is). "Build me a city like that guy from Tang has."
 
1292 - John Baliol becomes King of Scotland with the blessing of Edward I of England. I'll let you guess how well that goes over.
 
1558 - "Bloody" Mary I of England (a Catholic) dies and is replaced by her half-sister Elizabeth I (a Protestant). It's like spamming the "redo" button after you just hit "undo" a whole bunch of times.
 
1810 - At the demand of Napoleon, Sweden declares war on Great Britain. There will be no fighting and Sweden will allow Britain to "occupy" the island of Hanö, meaning their trading relationship is not affected in any way.
 
1831 - Ecuador and Venezuela break away from Gran Colombia. "It's not you; it's us. We should all totally still have matching flags, though."
 
1869 - Good news, everyone! We don't have to sail all the way around Africa anymore!
 
1938 - Look, I've got other things I've gotta take care of, so why don't we just agree to pretend I wrote a long, meandering, lyrical tale that ends with the birth of Gordon Lightfoot.
 
1942 - Martin Scorsese is born. I mean sure, some people might be into that sort of thing, but back in my day, people really made new little human beings, you know? They put their hearts and souls into it. You just don't see that with babies these days.
 
1973 - Richard Nixon announces to hundreds of reporters in Orlando, "I am not a crook." Narrator: "He was a crook."
 
1978 - The Star Wars Holiday Special does not air, because there is no such thing and never was. Moving on. Fighting the frizzies at 11.
 
1981 - Doug Walker is born. You know, that guy with the glasses.
 

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6 hours ago, Illjwamh said:

1978 - The Star Wars Holiday Special does not air, because there is no such thing and never was. Moving on. Fighting the frizzies at 11.

Let's hope Lucas or Disney or whoever holds the copyright will relent and release it by the fiftieth anniversary
Han should have been flying a Slick vehicle like The Jefferson Starship.

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On November 18 in History:
 
326 - Consecration of the old St. Peter's Basilica. Wait for it...
 
401 - Alaric I and his Visigoths cross the Alps into Italy. This is not the beginning. There are neither beginnings nor endings to the turning of the Wheel of Time. But it is A beginning. Of an end.
 
701 - Birth of Itzam Kʼan Ahk II, future ruler of the Mayan city now known as Piedras Negras. We know a good deal of what he did and what he built, but almost nothing about him personally aside from his name, and I don't even know what it means.
 
1095 - Pope Urban II calls a club meeting at Clermont in Auvergne, Aquitaine. On the docket: Helping the Byzantine Emperor, Taking Back the Holy Land. Not necessarily in that order.
 
1210 - Holy Roman Emperor Otto IV is excommunicated by Pope Innocent III. Daddy and Other Daddy are fighting!
 
1247 - Supposed death date of legendary outlaw Robin Hood, though in all fairness this one is rather difficult to pin down, owing chiefly to the fact that Robin could have been any one of roughly half a dozen different men, an amalgamation or some or all of them, or an entirely made up character who never existed at all. Why a date of death for such a man is even attempted in the first place is beyond me.
 
1302 - Pope Boniface VIII issues the bull Unam Sanctam, which lays out the necessity of belonging to the Catholic Church to achieve salvation, the total spiritual supremacy of the Pope over said Church, and therefore one must submit to the Pope in order to attain salvation. How convenient.
 
1626 - Consecration of the new St. Peter's Basilica. Now with more opulence!
 
1803 - The former slaves of Haiti, under Jean Jacques Dessalines, kick out the French for good at the Battle of Vertières. There's no concern they might try to come back, either; they currently have bigger problems to worry about.
 
1863 - Danish king Christian IX signs a new constitution declaring that the Duchy of Schleswig belongs to Denmark. Germany disagrees.
 
1872 - Fifteen American women, among them Susan B. Anthony, are arrested for the terrible, heinous crime of voting.
 
1883 - Railroads in the U.S. and Canada create time zones, ensuring that folks on the east coast will always be able to spoil the latest Game of Thrones episode for unwitting west coasters.
 
1905 - Prince Karl of Denmark becomes King of Norway, and changes his name to Haakon VII in the process because why not.
 
1916 - BEF Commander Douglas Haig gives up the Battle of the Somme as a bad job after 141 days nets an advance of 10 km. His decisive action will likely save untold thousands, if the over a million casualties incurred to this point are any indication.
 
1918 - Latvia declares itself independent from Russia. "Lol, sure, sure." ~Russia
 
1928 - Walt Disney and Ub Iwerks release the animated short "Steamboat Willie", starring their creation Mickey Mouse. It is the first cartoon with fully synchronized sound and groundbreaking doesn't begin to cover it. Guess which one of them ends up taking most of the credit. Hint: It's not the guy you've never heard of.
 
1939 - Birth of Margaret Atwood. Should she be celebrated for boldly depicting the logical extremes of patriarchal fundamentalists, or decried for giving them ideas?
 
1968 - Owen Wilson is born. Wow!
 
1971 - Oman declares independence from the United Kingdom. It's just the fashionable thing to do these days.
 
1993 - South Africa approves a new constitution that lets everyone vote regardless of skin color, meaning that the whole country will no longer be subject to the whims of a minority of the population. Meanwhile, the U.S. is still using the Electoral College.
 
2003 - The Supreme Court of Massachusetts rules that same-sex couples can legally marry, and the state is required to recognize such marriages. I feel a snowball coming on, y'all.

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32 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1863 - Danish king Christian IX signs a new constitution declaring that the Duchy of Schleswig belongs to Denmark. Germany disagrees.

Not one of our better moves. Strangely enough, our revised Constitution of 1866 does not mention Schleswig at all.

40 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1872 - Fifteen American women, among them Susan B. Anthony, are arrested for the terrible, heinous crime of voting.

We clearly need laws in place against the millions of women who illegally vote.

41 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1905 - Prince Karl of Denmark becomes King of Norway, and changes his name to Haakon VII in the process because why not.

And for years after he gloated over his older brother Crown Prince Christian, who had never stopped reminding Karl that one day he would be King and Karl wouldn't be. Serve the goober right.

54 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1918 - Latvia declares itself independent from Russia. "Lol, sure, sure." ~Russia

Rumours that it was subsequently taken over by Victor von Doom are entirely untrue. That was Latveria.

56 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

2003 - The Supreme Court of Massachusetts rules that same-sex couples can legally marry, and the state is required to recognize such marriages. I feel a snowball coming on, y'all.

Clearly this means that the institution of marriage is coming to an end and that God will punish Massachusetts terribly. But for some strange reason this was not followed by a stream of divorces when all other marriages in Massachusetts inevitably fell apart, caused by giving actual rights to same sex couples.

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23 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Let's hope Lucas or Disney or whoever holds the copyright will relent and release it by the fiftieth anniversary
Han should have been flying a Slick vehicle like The Jefferson Starship.

No.

 

On 11/18/2019 at 1:01 AM, Illjwamh said:
1978 - The Star Wars Holiday Special does not air, because there is no such thing and never was. Moving on. Fighting the frizzies at 11.

I saw it when it didn't air, and it is as bad as the rumors say.

 

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56 minutes ago, Darth Fluffy said:

I saw it when it didn't air, and it is as bad as the rumors say.

I honestly liked the Star Wars guest appearance on the Muppet Show. I understand that... the Holiday Special was less fortunate, as it were. From the few clips I have seen from it I am forced to accept this position.

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14 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I honestly liked the Star Wars guest appearance on the Muppet Show. I understand that... the Holiday Special was less fortunate, as it were. From the few clips I have seen from it I am forced to accept this position.

Whole heartedly agree, but the Muppets tend to be good quality entertainment.

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On November 19 in History:
 
1095 - "Go out there and get me that Holy Land!" ~Pope Urban II at the Council of Clermont
 
1703 - Death of The Man in the Iron Mask, a French prisoner of over thirty years about whom very little is known and whose name might have been Eustache Dauger. He didn't actually wear an iron mask, but "The Man in the Velvet Mask" lacks a certain air of mystery and just doesn't have the same ring to it.
 
1863 - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln delivers a two minute speech he wrote on a cocktail napkin on the way over at a cemetery dedication ceremony in Gettysburg and goes down in history for it. The guy before him was the keynote speaker and spoke for two hours. His name is not important enough for me to remember.
 
1912 - With the capture of the city of Bitola by the Serbian army, five centuries of Ottoman rule in Macedonia comes to an end. Excuse me, NORTH Macedonia. I wouldn't want to alienate the expansive Greek readers who care way too much about stuff that doesn't matter at all demographic.
 
1917 - Birth of future Indian prime minister Indira Gandhi. No relation.
 
1959 - Ford announces it's not going to make the Edsel anymore. And there was much rejoicing.
 
1969 - Pete Conrad and Alan Bean are the third and fourth human beings to walk on the moon, respectively. That's still amazing and why aren't they household names too? Only twelve people in human history have ever done this.
 
1975 - Death of Spanish dictator Francisco Franco. Good thing he set things up in advance to have King Juan Carlos carry on his fascist regime, eh?
 
1998 - The U.S. House of Representatives begin impeachment hearings against president Bill Clinton. There are a lot of solid quotes from prominent Republicans of the time such as Lindsey Graham and Mitch McConnell about why this is absolutely necessary. Give 'em a read; it's great fun.
 
2006 - Nintendo releases the Wii, perhaps its first console with a name completely impervious to juvenile jokes and puns.
 
2017 - Death of Charles Manson. I try not to say this too often - sanctity of human life and all - but good riddance.
 

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1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

1703 - Death of The Man in the Iron Mask, a French prisoner of over thirty years about whom very little is known and whose name might have been Eustache Dauger. He didn't actually wear an iron mask, but "The Man in the Velvet Mask" lacks a certain air of mystery and just doesn't have the same ring to it.

Really? I heard he got freed twenty years after by the Comte de Monte Christo aided by three musketeers.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

The guy before him was the keynote speaker and spoke for two hours. His name is not important enough for me to remember.

Clearly he lived at the wrong Gettysburg address.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

1969 - Pete Conrad and Alan Bean are the third and fourth human beings to walk on the moon, respectively. That's still amazing and why aren't they household names too? Only twelve people in human history have ever done this.

What I want to know is why Michael Collins and his colleagues are such darn afterthoughts. It's not as if what they did wasn't kinda important.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

1998 - The U.S. House of Representatives begin impeachment hearings against president Bill Clinton. There are a lot of solid quotes from prominent Republicans of the time such as Lindsey Graham and Mitch McConnell about why this is absolutely necessary. Give 'em a read; it's great fun.

We can all be happy that the GOP is there to represent the moral and ethical backbone of the country and that they would never, ever, ever fail to follow the example they themselves set or the standards they demanded.

1 hour ago, Illjwamh said:

2006 - Nintendo releases the Wii, perhaps its first console with a name completely impervious to juvenile jokes and puns.

Wii? How?

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On 11/20/2019 at 6:15 AM, Illjwamh said:
On November 19 in History:

 

1863 - U.S. President Abraham Lincoln delivers a two minute speech he wrote on a cocktail napkin on the way over at a cemetery dedication ceremony in Gettysburg and goes down in history for it. The guy before him was the keynote speaker and spoke for two hours. His name is not important enough for me to remember.

More than 1/4 of the Union Army died at Gettysburg, more than 1/3 of the Confederate Army.

Edward Everett was the name of the featured speaker. Quoting history.com : " Everett, the former president of Harvard College, former U.S. senator and former secretary of state, was at the time one of the country’s leading orators." It is worth noting that a two hour speech was customary and expected at the time. "

Lincoln's speech was short because that was his role, akin to being the one to use the scissors to cut the ribbon at a building dedication. Of course in hindsight, it is easy to see that a two minutes speech of less than three hundred words can be memorable, less so a two hour oratory.

That the Gettysburg Address was crafted on the train ride is a myth. Witnesses place the writing the days prior to the event. Lincoln's Secretary of State, William Seward accompanied him, so there may have been further discussion and possibly some revision along the way.

It was a well crafted piece designed to hammer home a few key points, the most radical of which, (and honestly, this had escaped me, the referenced article laid it out), was that the Declaration of Independence was a foundational document of our government. I've understood the notion, even scratched my head at "why?"; it never occurred to me that this speech is the one that drove it home,  linking the intention of the Founding Fathers laid out in the Declaration to how we govern. "Oh, that makes sense now; this is way more foundational that it might appear at first glance. It's more than just a really good speech." He was cutting the legs out from under the argument that "The Constitution does not forbid slavery."

 

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1 hour ago, Darth Fluffy said:

It was a well crafted piece designed to hammer home a few key points, the most radical of which, (and honestly, this had escaped me, the referenced article laid it out), was that the Declaration of Independence was a foundational document of our government. I've understood the notion, even scratched my head at "why?"; it never occurred to me that this speech is the one that drove it home,  linking the intention of the Founding Fathers laid out in the Declaration to how we govern. "Oh, that makes sense now; this is way more foundational that it might appear at first glance. It's more than just a really good speech." He was cutting the legs out from under the argument that "The Constitution does not forbid slavery."

The Declaration is a truly amazing document, a political weapon of such potency that it has time and again been turned on entrenched power structures -- even and especially its own heirs.

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On November 26 in History:
 
1476 - Vlad the Impaler, with a some help from a couple of guys named Stephen, defeats Basarab Laiota to become the ruler of Wallachia. Third time's the charm?
 
1504 - Death of Queen Isabella of Castile and León. She leaves behind a legacy of a completed reconquest of ancient lands, along with a famously brutal inquisition and the birth of colonial genocide over an entire hemisphere. Bet you weren't expecting that!
 
1789 - A national day of Thanksgiving is celebrated in the U.S. at the proclamation of George Washington on the request from Congress. It takes a while to catch on.
 
1863 - U.S. president Abraham Lincoln declares a national day of Thanksgiving. This time, he's savvy enough to declare that it should be an annual thing.
 
1917 - Formation of the National Hockey League. It has five teams: in Toronto, Ottawa, Québec City, and two in Montréal. With pitiful numbers like that, I don't see it lasting for very long.
 
1918 - Montenegro votes to be annexed by Serbia. They will come to...well, "regret" is a strong word.
 
1922 - Howard Carter and Lord Carnarvon defile the 3000 year old tomb of Tutankhamun. Evidently neither of them have ever seen a Universal Pictures B movie.
 
1922 again - Charles Schultz is born with a rare condition that causes him to hear the voice of anyone over ten years old as a muted trombone.
 
1941 - The Japanese 1st Air Fleet departs the Kuril Islands, heading southeast. Where could they be going?
 
1942 - Casablanca premiers in New York City. People immediately begin quoting it.
 
1950 - "Not so fast!" Chinese troops to U.N. allied soldiers in North Korea.

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7 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1922 - Howard Carter and Lord Carnarvon defile the 3000 year old tomb of Tutankhamun. Evidently neither of them have ever seen a Universal Pictures B movie.

Howard should clearly have paid more attention to his close relative Randolph's statement.

9 minutes ago, Illjwamh said:

1941 - The Japanese 1st Air Fleet departs the Kuril Islands, heading southeast. Where could they be going?

They couldn't possibly be going anywhere important. Besides, they were friends with the Nazis, and everybody knows that there are good people among these.

It was merely unfortunate that the rest of the Nazis were still alive.

 

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15 hours ago, Illjwamh said:

1922 - Howard Carter and Lord Carnarvon defile the 3000 year old tomb of Tutankhamun. Evidently neither of them have ever seen a Universal Pictures B movie.

I told the Front Desk at Valley of the Kings Hotel that the "Do Not DIsturb" signs should be multilingual
But would they listen?

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5 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

I told the Front Desk at Valley of the Kings Hotel that the "Do Not DIsturb" signs should be multilingual
But would they listen?

English tourists are notorious for not bothering with the local languages. Usually all they learn in the local speech is, "Do you speak English? No? Then get me someone who does, there's a good lad!"

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