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The Old Hack

Story Friday June 15, 2018

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Any hotel that features an interior corridor and has room service almost always requires some sort of identification and major credit card to check in.

There is more than cash in the estate of Sirleck.  Will the appropriate agencies be looking in the right direction when Magus swipes that card?

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49 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Will the appropriate agencies be looking in the right direction when Magus swipes that card?

One would hope so. I hate to think what would happen if inappropriate agencies started to meddle in this.

NORAD: "Magus has registered at the Moperville Motel. Prepare ICBM launch."

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1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Any hotel that features an interior corridor and has room service almost always requires some sort of identification and major credit card to check in.

We are NOT sure Magus actually checked in. Would explain why he couldn't call room service.

... you know, if he DID checked in AND used name "Magus", he shouldn't be that hard to find even without credit card.

Also, doesn't credit card usually also feature name?

1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

There is more than cash in the estate of Sirleck.  Will the appropriate agencies be looking in the right direction when Magus swipes that card?

We MAY be hitting limits of Dan's knowledge. Realistically speaking, transferring large amounts of money in untraceable way is hard and something government would already be searching for because it's almost surely tax evasion. There are certainly ways to do that anyway, but Dan, not having any criminal contacts, is unlikely to know any details about that.

On top of that, Sirleck have experience with that, but Magus, realistically speaking, doesn't. He WOULD make pretty obvious mistakes which might be hard to cover even with magic (case in point, using name which doesn't legally exists), BUT if Dan decides for plot reasons that he will success in hiding, then he will.

11 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

One would hope so. I hate to think what would happen if inappropriate agencies started to meddle in this.

As I already implied, the most likely agency meddling in this would be IRS.

IF he's in United states, at least. Actually, thinking about it, it WOULD make more sense if he would be on some island with less spying government, where they are used on people who are ready to pay instead of answering questions.

(If he would be in United States paying with Sirleck's credit card, the girl would likely be already taped by DGB, IRS and CIA ... which would make her unlikely to engage in any activities involving stripping).

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1 minute ago, hkmaly said:

As I already implied, the most likely agency meddling in this would be IRS.

Too bad. I suddenly realised that it would be totally awesome if the WWF and NASCAR started to go for him. Big muscular wrestlers in muscle cars racing to catch him. It would be like the A-Team, only twice the awesome and four times the cheese.

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53 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Maybe Magus is paying with Bitcoins?

Hmmmm ... bitcoins ARE ideal currency for body snatchers ... you just need to remember them, delete, switch body, write down ... :)

You know that all bitcoin transactions are public, traceable and permanently stored in the bitcoin network, so the only protection they offer is that connecting the bitcoin wallet to you may take some time, and not really that long?

Just using bitcoins won't protect you. You need lot of general "hiding yourself online" knowledge which, again, I don't think Magus possess.

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7 hours ago, hkmaly said:

There are certainly ways to do that anyway, but Dan, not having any criminal contacts, is unlikely to know any details about that.

Dan does watch a number of mysteries and crime dramas it seems, yeah some of them are set during times before credit cards and electronic banking, but if he's seen more modern ones then it's possible he's come across one where embezzlement and money laundering was talked about, even if it's not realistic, it could still serve as inspiration for how Sirleck was able to set aside enough that Magus wouldn't have to worry about drawing too much attention.

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I'm willing to cut Dan some slack on this. How to truly tracelessly transfer large amounts of money is specialized knowledge that is mostly of interest to criminals and police investigators, and Dan is in neither category.

In-setting, Sirleck has transferred his wealth from one host to another several times, has no scruples whatsoever, and presumably has lots of criminal contacts. I would expect him to be an expert at it, and Magus is now the beneficiary of that expertise.

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14 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Hmmmm ... bitcoins ARE ideal currency for body snatchers ... you just need to remember them, delete, switch body, write down ... :)

You know that all bitcoin transactions are public, traceable and permanently stored in the bitcoin network, so the only protection they offer is that connecting the bitcoin wallet to you may take some time, and not really that long?

Just using bitcoins won't protect you. You need lot of general "hiding yourself online" knowledge which, again, I don't think Magus possess.

I think I need to borrow that I'M JOKING sign from Grace. Bitcoins are another "foolproof" path to wealth in the tradition of Tulipmania, the South Sea Bubble, and Bernie Madoff. The only question I have is whether or not Bitcoins are a complete fraud or just an idea that won't work.

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2 hours ago, Douglas said:

I'm willing to cut Dan some slack on this. How to truly tracelessly transfer large amounts of money is specialized knowledge that is mostly of interest to criminals and police investigators, and Dan is in neither category.

9 hours ago, Scotty said:
16 hours ago, hkmaly said:

There are certainly ways to do that anyway, but Dan, not having any criminal contacts, is unlikely to know any details about that.

Dan does watch a number of mysteries and crime dramas it seems, yeah some of them are set during times before credit cards and electronic banking, but if he's seen more modern ones then it's possible he's come across one where embezzlement and money laundering was talked about, even if it's not realistic, it could still serve as inspiration for how Sirleck was able to set aside enough that Magus wouldn't have to worry about drawing too much attention.

Are you implying movie producers have enough contacts with criminals to actually know what to show in the crime drama? It couldn't be police investigators, those would be more likely to recommend something which doesn't work to make their job easier.

Also, yes, I'm not really expecting Dan to show any good way to tracelessly transfer money. In fact, if he truly described something which could work it might scary me.

2 hours ago, Douglas said:

In-setting, Sirleck has transferred his wealth from one host to another several times, has no scruples whatsoever, and presumably has lots of criminal contacts. I would expect him to be an expert at it, and Magus is now the beneficiary of that expertise.

The issue here is that Sirleck set up the transfer in way that assumed the RECEIVER of wealth would have lot of knowledge from criminal contacts and no scruples. And I don't think he taught Magus all necessary knowledge, not speaking about Magus not wanting to give up his scruples (although the offer WAS made).

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

I think I need to borrow that I'M JOKING sign from Grace.

Or you may use this one: :)

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Bitcoins are another "foolproof" path to wealth in the tradition of Tulipmania, the South Sea Bubble, and Bernie Madoff. The only question I have is whether or not Bitcoins are a complete fraud or just an idea that won't work.

The motivation of Bitcoins was decentralization and making sure stuff like fractional-reserve banking is impossible. Anonymity was NOT one of goals, therefore you can't say Bitcoins don't work just because they are not anonymous.

 

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54 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Are you implying movie producers have enough contacts with criminals to actually know what to show in the crime drama? It couldn't be police investigators, those would be more likely to recommend something which doesn't work to make their job easier.

Also, yes, I'm not really expecting Dan to show any good way to tracelessly transfer money. In fact, if he truly described something which could work it might scary me.

Movie producers, if they care enough to try, know or can find out enough to portray something that seems plausible to most of their audience. I'd expect that usually there are some important details either omitted or actually wrong.

For EGS, how it was done isn't particularly relevant to the story. I'm guessing it'll be left at "Sirleck knew how, and it worked", with few or no details revealed.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

The issue here is that Sirleck set up the transfer in way that assumed the RECEIVER of wealth would have lot of knowledge from criminal contacts and no scruples. And I don't think he taught Magus all necessary knowledge, not speaking about Magus not wanting to give up his scruples (although the offer WAS made).

Magus may be able to make up for a lot of that with magic. He specialized in battle magic, true, but he's also a wizard who received a systematic education that likely covered a lot of different stuff. Also, Sirleck set up the transfer in ways that assumed the receiver of wealth would have Magus' body. That factor is one that Magus does, in fact, genuinely have. I'd also expect him to have set it up with the money split among several different transfer mechanisms, so that any one of them being stopped by discovery or betrayal wouldn't leave him poor. There would inevitably be variation in how much knowledge and lack of scruples each one required, and Magus could just be grabbing some portion of them. Sirleck was rich enough that even a quarter of his wealth would probably be more than enough for anything Magus needs.

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22 minutes ago, Douglas said:

I'd also expect him to have set it up with the money split among several different transfer mechanisms, so that any one of them being stopped by discovery or betrayal wouldn't leave him poor. There would inevitably be variation in how much knowledge and lack of scruples each one required, and Magus could just be grabbing some portion of them. Sirleck was rich enough that even a quarter of his wealth would probably be more than enough for anything Magus needs.

Hmmmm ... that makes sense and could be interesting plot point ...

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22 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

that makes sense and could be interesting plot point ...

The idea that there are large amounts of money being held by banks and similar institutions for deceased depositors, with no way for potential heirs to claim those accounts, is a real concern that is so frequently overused in fiction that it makes legitimate claimants look like characters from made-for-TV movies.

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2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:
2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

that makes sense and could be interesting plot point ...

The idea that there are large amounts of money being held by banks and similar institutions for deceased depositors, with no way for potential heirs to claim those accounts, is a real concern that is so frequently overused in fiction that it makes legitimate claimants look like characters from made-for-TV movies.

The plot point obviously wouldn't be that there is no way, but that the way is either something which allows DGB to catch him, or better, ELLEN.

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53 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

The plot point obviously wouldn't be that there is no way, but that the way is either something which allows DGB to catch him, or better, ELLEN.

Or Elliot. The person who has the original of Magus' body, has a legal identity, and has a physical history in this world.

Or, someone else who in the routine course of things, upon learning of the death of Sirleck's old-man host, goes looking for the heir to this account or other piece of property... whom does he find? Most likely either (1) nobody or (2) Elliot.

Quite a lot of ways that Sirleck could transfer wealth from one host to another, would require that the new host have ID. If Magus has ID, it says his name is Elliot Dunkel. Elliot's ID also says that his name is Elliot Dunkel. If the aforementioned person-looking-for-an-heir goes looking for Elliot Dunkel, they will find Elliot's family, not Magus.

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41 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:
1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

The plot point obviously wouldn't be that there is no way, but that the way is either something which allows DGB to catch him, or better, ELLEN.

Or Elliot. The person who has the original of Magus' body, has a legal identity, and has a physical history in this world.

Besides the sex, Ellen looks almost exactly as Elliot. Can you imagine any bank clergy or anyone else just remotely official daring to mention any problem in such situation? Occams razor in such case says Ellen is transsexual and pointing it out would be rude.

45 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Or, someone else who in the routine course of things, upon learning of the death of Sirleck's old-man host, goes looking for the heir to this account or other piece of property... whom does he find? Most likely either (1) nobody or (2) Elliot.

Good point. Besides Dunkels searching on their own, someone else might decide to use them. Although he will probably find out they are not so easy target as he expected ...

(... still, easier target than Magus, and definitely easier to find.)

46 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Quite a lot of ways that Sirleck could transfer wealth from one host to another, would require that the new host have ID. If Magus has ID, it says his name is Elliot Dunkel. Elliot's ID also says that his name is Elliot Dunkel. If the aforementioned person-looking-for-an-heir goes looking for Elliot Dunkel, they will find Elliot's family, not Magus.

This is where Dan's not specifying what exactly Sirleck used might not be sufficient. Yes, Magus requires some ID. Yes, it would be easier if it would be connected to some real history. Except ... any connection to Elliot would be easy for DGB to follow. It would be actually SAFER for Magus if his ID would use something else. And if he NEVER used any name DGB knows, like Elliot, Ellen or ... Magus. Ooops. He just did used Magus. On phone call.

 

 

 

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The best laid plans and all that...

Magus doesn't plan to be in this reality for a moment longer than absolutely necessary.  And chances are good that cash and credit cards from the EGS side of reality won't be negotiable instruments in Magus's home universe.

So regardless of how much he took from Sirleck's estate, Magus may be spending freely, making it look like he has more money because he has no reason to save anything.

And if he were to try to take it with him?
First, what could he buy in the main EGS world that would be equally or more valuable in his home world?
Next, how much can he carry while making the transfer?

Does he actually know how to get back to his home world?
If not, does he know someone who can help him get back to his home world?
And is there still something for him to do in the main EGS world that he considers "necessary" before returning home?

I know the last set of questions has been asked several times before.  But they are worth repeating in relation to the other questions.

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Could Sirleck have acquired ID cards with Elliot's picture and some other name on them? Not impossible, but problematic.

To me the biggest issue is that there is no history between Sirleck and anyone-who-looks-like-Elliot. Transferring significant wealth from old-man-host to Magus-host, or to Magus, or to Elliot/Ellen, with no documentable past connection between them, is going to look suspicious no matter what. Them getting wealth seemingly out of nowhere would be equally suspicious. And the only ones of the possible heirs who could definitely stand up to both mundane and magical scrutiny, because they've done nothing relevant that's questionable, are Elliot and Ellen. (Plus, Magus probably does want to go back to his own universe.)

Sirleck should have recognized that he'd be much more likely to make a successful transfer if he had stopped at just taking over his butler's body.

Of course, that wouldn't get him a wizard body... but the way he chose to do that, pretty much maximized risk.

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1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Magus doesn't plan to be in this reality for a moment longer than absolutely necessary.  And chances are good that cash and credit cards from the EGS side of reality won't be negotiable instruments in Magus's home universe.

Credit cards DEFINITELY not. Those only work by connecting to issuing bank. But, he might convert that money to gold or something ... or better: microelectronics. That might be VERY valuable on his world.

1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Does he actually know how to get back to his home world?
If not, does he know someone who can help him get back to his home world?

Probably not.

1 hour ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

And is there still something for him to do in the main EGS world that he considers "necessary" before returning home?

... transforming Ellen?

42 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Could Sirleck have acquired ID cards with Elliot's picture and some other name on them? Not impossible, but problematic.

I'm sure he could. Now, would they survive detailed introspection? That's the question.

I think that even now, moving to different state - like, from US to EU - could help considerably. As foreigner, you don't need to produce so convincing set of documents as local person ...

42 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

To me the biggest issue is that there is no history between Sirleck and anyone-who-looks-like-Elliot. Transferring significant wealth from old-man-host to Magus-host, or to Magus, or to Elliot/Ellen, with no documentable past connection between them, is going to look suspicious no matter what. Them getting wealth seemingly out of nowhere would be equally suspicious.

Nevertheless, Sirleck DID done so before. He considers it hard but doable.

42 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Sirleck should have recognized that he'd be much more likely to make a successful transfer if he had stopped at just taking over his butler's body.

... yes. Although as far as we know, that MIGHT've been previous plan ...

42 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Of course, that wouldn't get him a wizard body... but the way he chose to do that, pretty much maximized risk.

Magus's powers and no scruples? Would be worth it.

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The first time Elliot, as a female, touched the diamond, Ellen emerged wearing an exact duplicate of what Elliot was wearing.

When Magus, in Elliot's body, touched the diamond several different things happened.
Elliot's body was duplicated, with a different hair colour.
Elliot's clothes were duplicated, in different colours.

Would Elliot's wallet have been duplicated?
If so, would the duplicated versions of Elliot's driver license and ATM card have been sufficiently accurate for ordinary commerce (like providing passable ID for an eighteen year old kid who wants to check into a nice hotel paying cash)?

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49 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Elliot's body was duplicated, with a different hair colour.
Elliot's clothes were duplicated, in different colours.

Would Elliot's wallet have been duplicated?

And if so, would the dollar bills in it be a different colour? :icon_eek:

And would anyone accept them if they were? :icon_eek:

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2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

The first time Elliot, as a female, touched the diamond, Ellen emerged wearing an exact duplicate of what Elliot was wearing.

Ellen also had car keys.

2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

Would Elliot's wallet have been duplicated?

Did Magus remembered to take Elliot's wallet? Because he might not have it for date at home. Unless he keeps it in jacket ... which makes sense actually ...

I still wonder where their phones were.

2 hours ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

If so, would the duplicated versions of Elliot's driver license and ATM card have been sufficiently accurate for ordinary commerce (like providing passable ID for an eighteen year old kid who wants to check into a nice hotel paying cash)?

Probably. Except, again, both would probably be traced by DGB. Not sure if hotels report who's accommodating but ATM card and credit cards definitely do report any use.

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2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Did Magus remembered to take Elliot's wallet? Because he might not have it for date at home. Unless he keeps it in jacket ... which makes sense actually ...

Actually, I wonder if Dan forgot that Magus would have a duplicate of Elliot's wallet.

I doubt Elliot would have had the money to pay for that pizza anyway and if there was a debit or credit card in there, using that would certainly alert Elliot to Magus' possible whereabouts. Maybe he just took what was in the wallet and destroyed it because stealing Elliot's identity was never Magus' intention, which would explain why he used Mr. Magus instead of Mr. Dunkel (assuming that Dunkel is also his last name considering Ellen's his real first name). Both names would equally draw attention to DGB if they were searching for anyone ordering stuff or renting a room or something.

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

I still wonder where their phones were.

Left at the Dunkel residence likely. I don't think Magus would have trashed them or dumped them out the car window halfway to the facility.

 

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