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Tom Sewell

Story Friday, December 14, 2018

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6 hours ago, hkmaly said:

... and Max. I mean, where else would Adrian AND Edward get such strange "cats"?

Probably from the lab that created Grace and Hedge. Experimental animals. This might imply that Adrian and Edward were working together then.

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11 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Also, I suspect you never stepped on true caltrop. (I didn't either, but I think it hurts more. Well ... maybe except the mlooney's case where he jumped on that dice.)

The point is that even stepping on a d4 HURTS. Just because it is less hazardous than stepping on an actual caltrop doesn’t mean it isn’t worth avoiding. And while a d4 may not be an actual caltrop it does share its most important trait: if it falls onto a flat surface it will always land with a point up.

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Just now, hkmaly said:

... and Max. I mean, where else would Adrian AND Edward get such strange "cats"?

Even if Adrian has less raw power, he certainly has more experience, so I don't believe he wouldn't be able to defeat Damien. However, I think he didn't have time to track him. Also, I would assume DGB would be able to defeat him, maybe not just one of them but together definitely ... they didn't fight him because they didn't knew where he was.

Adrian might have also sensed spicy magic from Damien, and then there's the fact that even if Adrian could match his experience against Damien's power, the best I could probably see happening would be similar to Adrian fighting Gullet, Damien's fast healing would make it difficult for Adrian to really hurt Damien so Adrian probably didn't think he was capable of killing Damien.

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4 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Adrian might have also sensed spicy magic from Damien, and then there's the fact that even if Adrian could match his experience against Damien's power, the best I could probably see happening would be similar to Adrian fighting Gullet, Damien's fast healing would make it difficult for Adrian to really hurt Damien so Adrian probably didn't think he was capable of killing Damien.

But Adrian took on Gullet anyway. What gave Adrian a chance against Gullet was the sword he borrowed from Susan. Adrian killed the previous vampire with a superspeed dash; the massive damage caused by the sword would probably have worked against Damien's magic-based power as well or better than Grace's claws.

However, given the way Adrian fought against Abraham, I think Adrian would have attacked anyway, so I don't think Adrian ever did confront Damien. Either Damien would have killed Adrian (in which case Pandora would have certainly killed Damien) or Adrian would have managed to kill Damien. It's clear from Damien's fight with Grace that he was never seriously hurt in a fight before and probably never had trouble killing anyone.

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Just now, Tom Sewell said:

But Adrian took on Gullet anyway. What gave Adrian a chance against Gullet was the sword he borrowed from Susan. Adrian killed the previous vampire with a superspeed dash; the massive damage caused by the sword would probably have worked against Damien's magic-based power as well or better than Grace's claws.

Adrian didn't really have a choice, and didn't know the extent of what he was facing until Gullet showed up, for all we know Gullet probably knew that his purpose was to hold Adrian's attention for Smiley, and Adrian could only hope that Gullet would let up for a moment to allow him move in for the kill, and even then, he expected Gullet might be able to use his other hand to cast a different spell. Adrian might have been pinned at that point and would have to rely on the possibility of help from Susan or someone else, otherwise it'd be a matter of who ran out of energy first and while Adrian is the son of an Immortal, I don't think he'd have limitless energy.

Also in terms of the sword, if that sword was enchanted specifically against aberrations (beyond just being a summoned magic weapon) as Susan believed, it might not have the intended effect against Damien, as such, Lespuko claws might not have an advantage against aberrations.

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13 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:
20 hours ago, hkmaly said:

... and Max. I mean, where else would Adrian AND Edward get such strange "cats"?

Probably from the lab that created Grace and Hedge. Experimental animals. This might imply that Adrian and Edward were working together then.

Yes, exactly my point.

13 hours ago, The Old Hack said:
On 12/15/2018 at 1:54 AM, hkmaly said:

Also, I suspect you never stepped on true caltrop. (I didn't either, but I think it hurts more. Well ... maybe except the mlooney's case where he jumped on that dice.)

The point is that even stepping on a d4 HURTS. Just because it is less hazardous than stepping on an actual caltrop doesn’t mean it isn’t worth avoiding. And while a d4 may not be an actual caltrop it does share its most important trait: if it falls onto a flat surface it will always land with a point up.

While true, I think Grace is exaggerating/overreacting. Of course, this is Grace: this MAY be normal for her.

12 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:
13 hours ago, Scotty said:

Adrian might have also sensed spicy magic from Damien, and then there's the fact that even if Adrian could match his experience against Damien's power, the best I could probably see happening would be similar to Adrian fighting Gullet, Damien's fast healing would make it difficult for Adrian to really hurt Damien so Adrian probably didn't think he was capable of killing Damien.

But Adrian took on Gullet anyway. What gave Adrian a chance against Gullet was the sword he borrowed from Susan. Adrian killed the previous vampire with a superspeed dash; the massive damage caused by the sword would probably have worked against Damien's magic-based power as well or better than Grace's claws.

However, given the way Adrian fought against Abraham, I think Adrian would have attacked anyway, so I don't think Adrian ever did confront Damien. Either Damien would have killed Adrian (in which case Pandora would have certainly killed Damien) or Adrian would have managed to kill Damien. It's clear from Damien's fight with Grace that he was never seriously hurt in a fight before and probably never had trouble killing anyone.

Aberrations are extremely hard to kill with anything else than summoned weapons ; fighting Damien, Adrian could use other options, just like in his fight with Abraham - but with Gullet, he decided the sword is his optimal chance, AND overestimated his opponent - he expected Gullet will have more than just fire.

I think Adrian WOULD fight Damien, and that he would NOT insist on taking his alone so it would be sporting. Even if he would for some reason end up against him alone, it would DEFINITELY not be easy fight for Damien - and, yes, based on his fight with Grace, it's obvious he was never in such fight. Note that besides the "Adrian will be killed" and "Damien would be killed", there is obvious option that Adrian will win, but won't kill because he's not that kind of person, underestimates Damien's regeneration and Damien will escape.

To conclude, I think that Adrian was reading the file on Damien and was preparing to fight him, but never get the option because they never knew where he is. Remember that they kept moving ; they only returned to the Nest when enough time passed for it to not be expected option.

12 hours ago, Scotty said:

Adrian might have been pinned at that point and would have to rely on the possibility of help from Susan or someone else, otherwise it'd be a matter of who ran out of energy first and while Adrian is the son of an Immortal, I don't think he'd have limitless energy.

Yes, Adrian wasn't able to hold the shield forever, but neither was Gullet capable of holding the fire forever, and besides their power, another variable is which spell consumes more energy. Adrian seemed worried with what will Gullet do next, but didn't seem to consider "keep the fire until you run out of energy" to be an option.

12 hours ago, Scotty said:

Also in terms of the sword, if that sword was enchanted specifically against aberrations (beyond just being a summoned magic weapon) as Susan believed, it might not have the intended effect against Damien, as such, Lespuko claws might not have an advantage against aberrations.

Even "ordinary" summoned magic weapons are supereffective against aberrations, and yes, I don't think Damien would be vulnerable in this way. On the other hand, I don't think his regeneration is comparable to the kind of regeneration aberrations have.

And yes: we don't know if Lespuko claws works against aberrations. I wouldn't rely on that on Grace's place. They are not summoned.

 

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1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

To conclude, I think that Adrian was reading the file on Damien and was preparing to fight him, but never get the option because they never knew where he is. Remember that they kept moving ; they only returned to the Nest when enough time passed for it to not be expected option.

There is the matter of Noah training to become strong enough to kill Damien, why would Adrian allow that? Were they going to double team Damien? Was Noah going to fight alone? Did Adrian feel that Noah, properly trained, could be more capable in fighting Damien than he could be?

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52 minutes ago, Scotty said:
2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

To conclude, I think that Adrian was reading the file on Damien and was preparing to fight him, but never get the option because they never knew where he is. Remember that they kept moving ; they only returned to the Nest when enough time passed for it to not be expected option.

There is the matter of Noah training to become strong enough to kill Damien, why would Adrian allow that? Were they going to double team Damien? Was Noah going to fight alone? Did Adrian feel that Noah, properly trained, could be more capable in fighting Damien than he could be?

I don't think Noah's and Adrian's opinion on this matched.

Like, there are lot of possibilities, including the fact that Noah would be willing to try to track Damien, while Adrian didn't think it's worth the time. But I would think that while Noah might be willing to fight Damien alone, Adrian wouldn't like that. On the other hand, doesn't mean Adrian was not aware at all: he might've been training Noah for that either because he realized he can't convince Noah otherwise, or hoping he WILL convince him during the training. Or, yes, he might've planned they will double team him (possibly in the variant of Noah finding him and then calling Adrian for help before the fight) OR Adrian was planing to find someone else who will team with Noah.

(It is possible that if Hedge wouldn't find Grace so fast, OR if Edward would be little more willing to cooperate, Grace would team up with Noah to kill Damien ... actually, IF this would be computer game, I would totally wonder where did I missed the option to recruit Noah to party before Painted Black ; alternatively, Noah would be VERY likely to end up in party to fight Damien second time if he would escape first time.)

Regardless that: There may be training allowing Noah to win fight with Damien. Like, Damien was all about fire, maybe using water would give Noah type advantage? In such case however, I don't think Adrian wouldn't be able to use same strategy. Or generally, no, I don't think Noah can be trained to be more capable in fighting Damien than Adrian. Unless the training itself needs to include something Adrian can't do due to rules.

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6 hours ago, hkmaly said:

 

While true, I think Grace is exaggerating/overreacting. Of course, this is Grace: this MAY be normal for her.

I tend to agree. After all, Grace has a history of being extremely protective of her friends. She blamed herself for failing to resist Abraham’s sleep spell and has ever since reacted very strongly against anything perceived as even a potential threat (witness her charge against Santa Jerry in the cave and her attitude against abominations that made Justin want to talk her down, for example.)

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Sky    3
On 15/12/2018 at 0:52 PM, The Old Hack said:

The point is that even stepping on a d4 HURTS. Just because it is less hazardous than stepping on an actual caltrop doesn’t mean it isn’t worth avoiding.

Actual caltrops do  go through shoes, it's worth noting. That said,l I would think Grace would actually be fine with the D4s if she trod on one - and would like you see caltrops due to better awareness. I tried one myself today, with my own tough feet, and I'd say short of jumping on one from a great night they aren't that much of a bother. Lego is easy too. The d4 would be a bit of a suprise poke if I didn't see it - but not much more than that.

That said - Grace doesn't go barefoot outside that much anymore.

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7 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

I tend to agree. After all, Grace has a history of being extremely protective of her friends. She blamed herself for failing to resist Abraham’s sleep spell and has ever since reacted very strongly against anything perceived as even a potential threat (witness her charge against Santa Jerry in the cave and her attitude against abominations that made Justin want to talk her down, for example.)

The talk with Justin was Grace saying that she'd tear anyone bad enough that they have to fight to shreds. Grace's talk with Edward though, was about aberrations.

Otherwise, yes she's very protective of her friends and also wants them to be happy, so anything that would potentially made them sad would be seen as a threat as seen by Grace jumping the counter to hug Sarah earlier. Grace sees Sam's secret as having the potential to make Sarah sad, but fighting is obviously out of the question because Sam isn't a bad guy, still the dilemma remains about how to keep Sarah happy.

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Re: the talk about Adrian fighting Damien.

It's possible (I think likely) that the same rules that prevent him from joining the military would also have prevented him from hunting Damien down. The only reason he was able to fight Abraham, and I assume the only reason he was able to fight the aberrations at the mall, is that he was defending people who were in immediate danger.

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2 hours ago, ChronosCat said:

Re: the talk about Adrian fighting Damien.

It's possible (I think likely) that the same rules that prevent him from joining the military would also have prevented him from hunting Damien down. The only reason he was able to fight Abraham, and I assume the only reason he was able to fight the aberrations at the mall, is that he was defending people who were in immediate danger.

Considering the danger that Damien posed, and the nature of his creation, if Adrian did find himself anywhere near Damien, the rules shouldn't have applied. Adrian wasn't allowed to join a country's military because he would provide that side an advantage with magic, but Damien was an unnatural being that already had the attention of people in the know and with similar skills as Adrian, so the only things the could have stopped Adrian from acting would either have been him considering Damien to be more powerful than himself, or he was following the orders of someone else, like if he was told to take Noah to safety.

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On 12/16/2018 at 8:01 PM, Scotty said:
On 12/16/2018 at 4:58 PM, ChronosCat said:

Re: the talk about Adrian fighting Damien.

It's possible (I think likely) that the same rules that prevent him from joining the military would also have prevented him from hunting Damien down. The only reason he was able to fight Abraham, and I assume the only reason he was able to fight the aberrations at the mall, is that he was defending people who were in immediate danger.

Considering the danger that Damien posed, and the nature of his creation, if Adrian did find himself anywhere near Damien, the rules shouldn't have applied. Adrian wasn't allowed to join a country's military because he would provide that side an advantage with magic, but Damien was an unnatural being that already had the attention of people in the know and with similar skills as Adrian, so the only things the could have stopped Adrian from acting would either have been him considering Damien to be more powerful than himself, or he was following the orders of someone else, like if he was told to take Noah to safety.

He said he can act directly if the situation involves magic or is an immediate thread to himself or others. Both Abraham and aberrations fulfilled BOTH conditions. Army, meanwhile? He couldn't pass the training.

We are not entirely sure if the way Damien was created counts as magic enough. In fact, even Adrian himself may not be sure. And the point about "immediate thread" ... hmmm ... he might need to give Damien first hit. However, I don't think it would be problem. He could even seriously try to talk him down and Damien would still attack.

Tracking down Damien probably doesn't count as fighting so he would be allowed, but I still think that he did not consider it his job and didn't exactly have time for it. Also, he may not be THAT good in hunting people. So, it's quite understandable that other people in DGB were searching for Damien and Adrian was just ready to help.

And remember, Edward was not on place when Damien attacked. Nor anyone else from DGB, based on the fact it wasn't serious fight. I think that DGB including Edward AND Adrian arrived at the place AFTER Damiens attacked, but too late to actually meet him. But soon enough to take the cats.

And Noah never met Damien. Damien killed his parents but he was not there. He never met his mother.

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