Story Monday, July 22, 2019

[The Old Hack 2,448]

11 minutes ago, ijuin said:

On Magneto wanting to change all non-Mutants into Mutants, such a plan might even have gained him much support among the non-Mutant-hating population, many of whom would welcome the opportunity to gain Mutant abilities (at least for mutations that did not grant an inhuman physical appearance).

I think I could have done without the instability factor that would make me dissolve into nothingness a few hours later, mind you.

[ijuin 572]

Oh, sorry, I meant if Magneto's plan had worked as he had intended. Making everyone safely into Mutants would be seen as a "good thing" by quite a lot of people.

[The Old Hack 2,448]

25 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Oh, sorry, I meant if Magneto's plan had worked as he had intended. Making everyone safely into Mutants would be seen as a "good thing" by quite a lot of people.

I still think he might be oversimplifying a bit, or at the very least be replacing one problem with a whole host of others. *scratches head* There's power imbalances between mutants, for example. For every Magneto or Phoenix there will likely be hundreds or even thousands of hapless sods who gain the mutant ability equivalent in power of making their body hair switch colours, for example. Political groupings will stay. The world economy would be at least temporarily sent into havoc by mutant abilities radically shifting levels of supply and demand. I mean, just a few element transmuters and all of a sudden rare metals might be a non-issue in the future. Then there's the question of what happens when a whole lot of have-nots gain the power to do something against the haves... yeesh.

Still, it might be worth it in Magneto's point of view. At least it would be everybody against everybody then and not just everybody against the mutants.

[The Old Hack 2,448]

32 minutes ago, ijuin said:

Oh, sorry, I meant if Magneto's plan had worked as he had intended. Making everyone safely into Mutants would be seen as a "good thing" by quite a lot of people.

...I just thought of something. What if his plan had worked as intended? That the mutants so created had been stable, healthy and fertile reproduction-wise? What would you have done if you had been a mutant? Would you have tried to stop Magneto anyway?

I think I would have anyway. If for nothing else to save Rogue. If Magneto wanted that magnificent everybody-is-mutants future so badly, he could damn well have laid his own life on the line. The Magneto I once read about would have, too. He'd never have put the life of another mutant on the line just for his own plans, not unless they were a volunteer.

[ijuin 572]

Power imbalances in an all-Mutant world would be no greater than the imbalance between the most powerful Mutants and the mundane non-Mutants already had been--assuming of course that very few Mutants end up significantly less powerful than if they had never become Mutants in the first place (e.g. gaining the ability to breathe underwater while losing the ability to breathe air might be considered a net loss).

[The Old Hack 2,448]

3 hours ago, ijuin said:

Power imbalances in an all-Mutant world would be no greater than the imbalance between the most powerful Mutants and the mundane non-Mutants already had been--assuming of course that very few Mutants end up significantly less powerful than if they had never become Mutants in the first place (e.g. gaining the ability to breathe underwater while losing the ability to breathe air might be considered a net loss).

True, but it would still upset stability because the differences would be placed between completely random individuals. The cops you used to be terrified of will not seem nearly as terrifying if they gain abilities like super enhanced tactile senses and you turn into Colossus, for example.

[hkmaly 490]

18 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

The Nazis possess power and are organising themselves for mass murder once more.

Damn. I must watch news more often.

I though Nazis are still at the point they don't have enough power to publicly admit they are nazis. (Although they already have enough power they don't need to work too hard on hiding it ; they just deny it).

16 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

17 hours ago, ijuin said:

Oh, sorry, I meant if Magneto's plan had worked as he had intended. Making everyone safely into Mutants would be seen as a "good thing" by quite a lot of people.

...I just thought of something. What if his plan had worked as intended? That the mutants so created had been stable, healthy and fertile reproduction-wise? What would you have done if you had been a mutant? Would you have tried to stop Magneto anyway?

I think I would have anyway. If for nothing else to save Rogue. If Magneto wanted that magnificent everybody-is-mutants future so badly, he could damn well have laid his own life on the line. The Magneto I once read about would have, too. He'd never have put the life of another mutant on the line just for his own plans, not unless they were a volunteer.

If ordinary mutant, I would probably not know there's something on stake. As X-Men however? Yes, mainly on ground that he should be really sure it works before deploying. He should done more experiments. On WILLING subjects, I'm sure he would find some. Just because that one person would survive doesn't mean the process is safe.

Also, yes, saving Rogue. Just, like, I think she could still be saved few transformed politicians later.

(It's not explained in detail, but I would assume the risk for the person inside the device is related to radius of the field, so it should be possible to transform multiple people at once without the drain being worse than with single politician.)

13 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

16 hours ago, ijuin said:

Power imbalances in an all-Mutant world would be no greater than the imbalance between the most powerful Mutants and the mundane non-Mutants already had been--assuming of course that very few Mutants end up significantly less powerful than if they had never become Mutants in the first place (e.g. gaining the ability to breathe underwater while losing the ability to breathe air might be considered a net loss).

True, but it would still upset stability because the differences would be placed between completely random individuals. The cops you used to be terrified of will not seem nearly as terrifying if they gain abilities like super enhanced tactile senses and you turn into Colossus, for example.

Magneto didn't planned to transform everyone at once. The plan was just to transform politicians and decision makers, at least in that first step. Presumably, there would be organized police consisting of mutants with useful abilities before enough criminals would be transformed for this to be serious problem.

Also, it's not like the situation with random mutants already appearing, just in smaller numbers, was so much stable. And I don't think stability is worth "curing" mutants. I believe evolutionary speaking mutants would remain and ordinary humans would go extinct, I just think it would be better if that happens with last human dying by old age surrounded by his loving mutant kids instead of in big war with huge causalities on both sides.

 

 

[Don Edwards 548]

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Also, it's not like the situation with random mutants already appearing, just in smaller numbers,

This seems sorta relevant...

[The Old Hack 2,448]

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Damn. I must watch news more often.

You really need to. You clearly haven't been paying attention.

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

I though Nazis are still at the point they don't have enough power to publicly admit they are nazis. (Although they already have enough power they don't need to work too hard on hiding it ; they just deny it).

Yes, yes, and them calling themselves something different makes them harmless, of course. Ah, the joyful complacency of those who naïvely think they can not be affected, possibly because they are not on the obvious list of primary targets. Too bad that that list keeps getting longer and longer as time marches on...

[Don Edwards 548]

Today the Nazis have to vociferously accuse anyone who opposes them of being Nazis.

That's how little of an immediate threat they are... which has no bearing on how big a threat they may become.

What's more worrisome than the Nazis is the number of government officials, particularly in or with oversight over police agencies, who would rather let the Nazis rampage than risk being accused of being a Nazi.

[The Old Hack 2,448]

5 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

Today the Nazis have to vociferously accuse anyone who opposes them of being Nazis.

That's how little of an immediate threat they are... which has no bearing on how big a threat they may become.

DING DING DING DING DING.

[hkmaly 490]

19 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

22 hours ago, hkmaly said:

I though Nazis are still at the point they don't have enough power to publicly admit they are nazis. (Although they already have enough power they don't need to work too hard on hiding it ; they just deny it).

Yes, yes, and them calling themselves something different makes them harmless, of course. Ah, the joyful complacency of those who naïvely think they can not be affected, possibly because they are not on the obvious list of primary targets. Too bad that that list keeps getting longer and longer as time marches on...

Not harmless. Just, as Don Edwards said, not immediate threat.

Also, I'm sort of optimist hoping that they can be stopped before they get to next level. Of course, that would require some other alternative ; if all you can choose from are nazis and people who think we need to be nice to nazis ...

17 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

What's more worrisome than the Nazis is the number of government officials, particularly in or with oversight over police agencies, who would rather let the Nazis rampage than risk being accused of being a Nazi.

... yes.

Politicians really need to remember the value of middle path. Too often, both extremes are bad.

(Although, some politicians are so expert they manage to make a middle path worse than both extremes.)

[The Old Hack 2,448]

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Not harmless. Just, as Don Edwards said, not immediate threat.

I take your meaning. Just please note that he said 'how little of an immediate threat', not 'no immediate threat.' They are certainly a sufficiently immediate threat in places like El Paso and Dayton.

2 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Also, I'm sort of optimist hoping that they can be stopped before they get to next level. Of course, that would require some other alternative ; if all you can choose from are nazis and people who think we need to be nice to nazis ...

I do not blame you for your optimism. It is comforting and I would like to think that you are right. Unfortunately I do not share it. I am sufficiently concerned that I am taking an active stance against them and will resist them to the end.

[hkmaly 490]

22 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

On 8/7/2019 at 1:01 AM, hkmaly said:

Not harmless. Just, as Don Edwards said, not immediate threat.

I take your meaning. Just please note that he said 'how little of an immediate threat', not 'no immediate threat.' They are certainly a sufficiently immediate threat in places like El Paso and Dayton.

I think even there they are not immediate thread as an organization. Of course, even individuals can do some damage. And while generally blaming the ideology might not be right, in case of Nazi ideology the blame is usually correct.

 

[The Old Hack 2,448]

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

I think even there they are not immediate thread as an organization.

I could argue that, but I think we might get tangled into a semantic death trap as to whether an indirect threat can be an immediate threat or not if I do, so I'll pass.