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      Welcome!   03/05/2016

      Welcome, everyone, to the new 910CMX Community Forums. I'm still working on getting them running, so things may change.  If you're a 910 Comic creator and need your forum recreated, let me know and I'll get on it right away.  I'll do my best to make this new place as fun as the last one!
Tom Sewell

Story Monday, August 12, 2018

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2 hours ago, Scotty said:
6 hours ago, The Old Hack said:

May I be blunt? I feel Justin is clearly better off. Melissa stalked him, she constantly attempted to gaslight his homosexuality after outing him and she did not even have the grace to give him space to heal. That she had the fucking GALL to make the fact that Justin was still angry to center on her just shows that she is still toxic to him.

She did the right thing in walking away. She did absolutely not do anything right by shittily manipulating the fact that he was still angry and twisting it into something bad on his part before she walked away. As to the crocodile tears she shed on the way, I hope she chokes on them.

I don't believe she had any intent on twisting what Justin said against him or make him feel bad about it, considering on the Friday, she didn't know what to say after Justin said they should talk, by Monday she didn't want to talk, I believe she spent the weekend thinking about what happened and coming to the conclusion that she didn't deserve any forgiveness, and hated the idea that it took saving Elliot to get Justin to want to talk to her, Justin's "After you outed me" seemed like proof of what she thought.

As for the tears, I don't see any maliciousness in them, I'd argue that she caught herself getting emotional and cut herself off before she did something else she might regret, it would explain why she suddenly didn't want to talk. This isn't defending Melissa's past actions though and certainly not saying that you should forgive those actions, I just feel that in this particular instance, Justin might have seen Melissa being genuine for the first time in the past 2 years and that could be why he felt bad about it.

I'm not exactly sure she thinks she doesn't deserve any forgiveness. It's more that she realizes it wouldn't help even in the case she gets it.

She's still in love with Justin, but not Justin as he's now, Justin how he was before ... or maybe wasn't but she though he is. And I think that during the weekend, she realized the difference and that no matter what, she can't get HER Justin "back".

Any contact between them is just going to remind Justin what her sister done to him (does Justin even knows what happened? Hmmm ... probably was part of those "countless apologizes", but did he listened? Does he believe it?) and remind her the Justin she will never get ... they are both better with as little contact as possible.

She could skip the remarks in panel 2 and 3, but I think her tears are genuine and related to what she said in 4,5 and 6.

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5 hours ago, Scotty said:

I don't believe she had any intent on twisting what Justin said against him or make him feel bad about it,

I don't care what her intentions bloody were. She also didn't intend to hurt Justin by stalking him for two years and gaslighting him. Intentions count for precisely two things, and one of them is jack. Results count. In fact, they're everything.

Let's take a look at the page in question.

"This is what it took. After two years and countless apologising, I had to help save your friend's life before you'd forgive me?"

No. Absolutely no. That was emotional blackmail. Justin had NO moral obligation to accept her apology. And the countless apologies and the constant stalking made things WORSE. If she had allowed Justin space to heal, maybe he would have forgiven her by then already. Justin is a much kinder and gentler soul than I am, so he probably would have. But by picking at his injury and repeatedly tearing it open, she herself virtually guaranteed that there would be no forgiveness. There was no blame on Justin there. It was all on Melissa. ALL ON HER. Yet she instantly and easily shifted it to Justin, showing precisely how little she cared about his pain and how much it was all about her.

And yeah, good for her that she helped save Elliot and I am certainly thankful for that. That STILL didn't give her any right to weaponise that action to hammer her emotional manipulation home. FUCK THAT.

"I accidentally did something horrible to you and I am truly sorry for that, but I loved..."

Yeah, no. The two years of stalking and gaslighting was 'accidental'? Also, any apology where you insert a 'but' and a justification is an attempt to evade responsibility. "I am sorry for hitting you, but in my defence your face just looked like it needed punching."

"I don't have the right to be mad at you..."

OH THANK GOODNESS A BRIEF BREATH OF HONESTY IN ALL THE EMOTIONAL BLACKMAIL AND GASLIGHTING. Then again, a competent abuser will be careful to insert a few of these to make their shittiness easier to swallow. If they can be used to reinforce how horrible the abuse victim is being to the abuser, all the better.

"I promise not to bother you anymore."

YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE THAT TWO YEARS AGO WHEN HE FIRST TOLD YOU HE DIDN'T WANT YOU IN HIS LIFE ANYMORE, you horrible toxic waste dump excuse for a person.

5 hours ago, Scotty said:

I honestly was ready to have my previous post be my last on the subject, but I strongly felt that your description of that scene was off, I don't know if that's because this conversation overall has gotten emotions high.

In that case we really do have to disagree. I am sorry, but Melissa's pattern of abusiveness has not at all changed for me. It has only gotten subtler, and hence more poisonous. She had NO NEED to fire all that crap at Justin. She could just have said "Thank you. But... I think we had better keep our distance still. I am not ready to handle this right now."

And she certainly shouldn't have used his justifiable anger to hurt him or held her efforts to save Elliot over his head like a hammer.

2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Noah told Elliot that it was Melissa's sister - not Melissa - who blabbed all over the place.

Yeah, no, she still outed him in the first place. I agree it was a human error. But it was a BAD one and she is still responsible for the ruins of Justin's life. As I have said before, intentions don't count. Results do.

2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

And her later actions and comments (ahem) didn't help.

NO SHIT SHERLOCK.

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If intentions mean nothing and results everything, then there is no separation between negligence resulting in death vs. premeditated murder. The result is the same—the death of the victim. What does it matter if the person liable for the death had malice aforethought as opposed to neglecting to properly maintain the brakes on his car?

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1 hour ago, ijuin said:

If intentions mean nothing and results everything, then there is no separation between negligence resulting in death vs. premeditated murder. The result is the same—the death of the victim. What does it matter if the person liable for the death had malice aforethought as opposed to neglecting to properly maintain the brakes on his car?

Sophistry. You are arguing legal distinctions. I guarantee you that no matter which of these lie behind, the victim is still equally dead. And the dependents are still equally harmed emotionally and personally.

If you are for some twisted reason bringing up whether the person responsible should be forgiven or not, take that one to the survivors. They might want to debate that one with you. I won't, I stand by my position that forgiveness is an individual decision and that no-one is required to either forgive or forget if they do not wish to.

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