• Announcements

    • Robin

      Welcome!   03/05/2016

      Welcome, everyone, to the new 910CMX Community Forums. I'm still working on getting them running, so things may change.  If you're a 910 Comic creator and need your forum recreated, let me know and I'll get on it right away.  I'll do my best to make this new place as fun as the last one!
Darth Fluffy

D&D OGL 1.1

Recommended Posts

Curious, I doubt they can revoke the previous OGL. In either case, I'm willing to move to D&D Zero in response to this bull$#!%, and take note of any other Hasbro products to specifically avoid them.

Hasbro owns the trademarks and products of Kenner, Milton Bradley, Parker Brothers, Wizards of the Coast, NERF, My Little Pony, Monopoly, Transformers, and more. Wiki has a list. Hit them where it hurts, avoid their c&@p.

This explains why the last Thor sucked.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I haven't read the official release of the OGL 1.1, so I can't say how much it's going to effect my projects.  Part of my issues is going to be based on the fact that most of my Open Game Content that I am reusing is from Mongoose's Traveller SRD and what isn't is from some OSR games that are based on the 3.5 SRD, if even that.  I'm going to see what happens with them before I deiced on what to do.  I may scrap the OSR stuff and write my own classes which will avoid the whole issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They have deep pockets, so they capable of being a public nuisance in court. I don't think they have a leg to stand on, but they are 'more established', which will carry weight with some judges. Ignorance about the gaming community and detachment from promises that were made decades ago will weight in their favor.

May they die horribly for their disregard of ethical behavior.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Important part of the statement from WotC re the next OGL:

 

Quote

The next OGL will contain the provisions that allow us to protect and cultivate the inclusive environment we are trying to build and specify that it covers only content for TTRPGs. That means that other expressions, such as educational and charitable campaigns, livestreams, cosplay, VTT-uses, etc., will remain unaffected by any OGL update. Content already released under 1.0a will also remain unaffected. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Open Gaming License is a way to use D&D rules in your own work.  The original version was based on the GNU license.  Wizards of the Coast is making changes to the license for the 1st time in 20 some odd years.  Many people objected to the changes and Wizard sorta walked back the worse of the changes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, mlooney said:

The Open Gaming License is a way to use D&D rules in your own work. The original version was based on the GNU license.  Wizards of the Coast is making changes to the license for the 1st time in 20 some odd years.  Many people objected to the changes and Wizard sorta walked back the worse of the changes.

Wizards can do what they want with their new intellectual properties, moving forward. What has everyone pissed at them is that they are trying to retroactively claw back commitments they made decades ago, to the gaming community at large, regarding a rule system they no longer use, to allow others to use the same system. Authors and companies have spent those two decades building on that rule system and creating numerous enhancements, all of which have benefited the overall marketability of the system, which to some degree WotC benefits from.

I'll take some issue with "Wizards of the Coast is making Changes to the license ..."; add 'attempting to', and it reads fine. I don't think the license is revocable, although, as I said, applied up to the point where they change their mind. Someone might argue they cannot change the license for any future D&D. I don't think that would fly (but I'm not a lawyer). We'll see, I suppose. Also note, not all the OGL publishers are in the US.

Bear in mind, Wizards of the Coast was founded by gamers who appreciated the products. When TSR was in trouble, WotC bought them out and invested in keeping D&D viable. This isn't the same crew any longer. WotC is owned by Hasbro, and the gamers have been replaced by corporate minions. The former head of WotC that was at the helm when the OGL was released is not a fan of this move.

I'll give Hasbro this, they must have a gift of monetization, because they've swallowed up companies with much better products.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Darth Fluffy said:

I'll take some issue with "Wizards of the Coast is making Changes to the license ..."; add 'attempting to', and it reads fine.

I suspect that WotC will make changes to the OGL, releasing OGL 2.0, which must be used for what ever replaces the 5.1 SRD or later products.  It appears that they are leaving the OGL 1.0a alone for now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, mlooney said:

I suspect that WotC will make changes to the OGL, releasing OGL 2.0, which must be used for what ever replaces the 5.1 SRD or later products.  It appears that they are leaving the OGL 1.0a alone for now.

Yes, well, you step in $#@!, it's best not to put the other foot in.

I hope you are right. In any case, if they issue a new OGL1.n, there are plenty of copies of the original in circulation.

I don't expect that Hasbro management has gotten any smarter. They won't remember they've burned their fingers a month from now. Some dimwit will eventually decide to double down.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, Darth Fluffy said:

I don't expect that Hasbro management has gotten any smarter

Hasbro's problems, and the OGL was just their latest, seems to have come about when they hired some one from Microsoft to be COO of WotC, then later as CEO of the whole company.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, Darth Fluffy said:

They won't do that at the Hasbro level. WotC is a side show for them. Of course, gaming is more mainstream in this generation, so maybe ...

Actually, no WotC isn't a side show.  The current CEO was the COO of WotC before he became the CEO of Hasbro.  Granted his job before WotC was at Microsoft, but right now WotC is their chief cash cow.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, mlooney said:

Actually, no WotC isn't a side show.  ... right now WotC is their chief cash cow.

Hmm. You could be right, TTRPGs are far more mainstream than they were in my day, not really just a geek thing any more. And yes, MtG is a brilliant cash cow. It's like printing money.

 

13 hours ago, mlooney said:

The current CEO was the COO of WotC before he became the CEO of Hasbro.  Granted his job before WotC was at Microsoft, ...

Not sure how much gamer cred that buys him, I'm dubious if his time helming WotC gives him much. He's essentially undermining decades of previous leadership, and it does not look to me that he is doing it from the point of view that he's improving the game play aspects.

Was WotC in trouble when Hasbro bought them? They may just be good at monetizing valuable properties that other folks, perhaps more invested in those product, fail to market well. I find it odd that they were able to buy Milton Bradley, which by modern standards has a stable of lame games, but which were always popular and sold well, which you could find everywhere back in the day[ now they seem to have disappeared from shelves. I find it odd that they were able to buy Parker Brothers, which had Monopoly, a perennial favorite that everyone played. (Not arguing that is a good game, just, it's everywhere.) They have done a good job marketing themed Monopolies, with custom tokens.

But riddle me this, name a popular Hasbro product from your childhood. I can not. I know they were around, but I don't recall what they sold.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Darth Fluffy said:

Was WotC in trouble when Hasbro bought them?

I don't think so.  They had MtG going strong and were just about to release 3.0 D&D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Darth Fluffy said:

But riddle me this, name a popular Hasbro product from your childhood. I can not. I know they were around, but I don't recall what they sold.

As a child of the 80s: Transformers, G.I.Joe, and My Little Pony (though Transformers was the only one of the three I was into at the time). (Not that I could have told you Hasbro made them at the time, but I didn't really pay attention to what brands made toys and games back then.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ChronosCat said:

As a child of the 80s: Transformers, G.I.Joe, and My Little Pony (though Transformers was the only one of the three I was into at the time). (Not that I could have told you Hasbro made them at the time, but I didn't really pay attention to what brands made toys and games back then.)

I'm a child of the 60's and I remember G.I. Joe back when they were 12" tall.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, ChronosCat said:

As a child of the 80s: Transformers, G.I.Joe, and My Little Pony (though Transformers was the only one of the three I was into at the time). (Not that I could have told you Hasbro made them at the time, but I didn't really pay attention to what brands made toys and games back then.)

Transformers were initially developed and released in Japan, in the early 1980s. I vaguely remember some of the pre-transformer concepts, they were more organized, combat focused, and though still odd, a bit less toy like. Hasbro bought the toy lines and partnered with Takara to crank them out. They invested heavily in marketing through story line and media, and it paid off. It always seemed to me that a major part of the appeal was the puzzle-like nature of transforming the figures. Introduced after my time, and my kids came after the initial hay day and never got into them.

G.I. Joe was indeed introduced by Hasbro, in 1964. They purchased the concept from an independent developer for $100,000 .00, but to be fair, it was an innovative and risky idea initially, so from Hasbro's point of view, it was a gamble. I got one for Christmas when they first came out; my first reaction was, "A doll?" The military setting and accessories were cool enough, although actually somewhat archaic; the gear was WW II -ish, but in many ways it was not even as much fun as green army men. I think they saved the line by switching to smaller, cheaper figures that you could accumulate for battles. Although, I did like the video I saw somewhere where G.I. Joe pulls up to Barbie's place and she ditches Ken and drives of with G.I. Joe.

My Little Pony started as My Pretty Pony, introduced by Hasbro in 1981. It morphed from just an isolated horse to play with into the more character oriented My Little Pony toys of today the next year. I do have this t-shirt of The Four Little Ponies of the Apocalypse from Woot!. It is one of my favorite shirts.

 

1 hour ago, mlooney said:

I'm a child of the 60's and I remember G.I. Joe back when they were 12" tall.

I did not understand at the time that one guy would not use all that cool junk. It was really not one of my favorite toys, building sets like Lego or Erector had more possibilities.

Do you remember the truly dangerous chemistry sets that GIlbert put out? A kid could do serious damage to himself and others with those.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Darth Fluffy said:

Do you remember the truly dangerous chemistry sets that GIlbert put out? A kid could do serious damage to himself and others with those.

I had a major chemistry set as a child.  Wasn't a Gilbert, but was still impressive and large.  Had it's own table, with a sink.  Granted the water supply was a gallon jug and it drained into bucket.  I had the ingredients to make black powder, which, of course, I made. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, mlooney said:

I had a major chemistry set as a child.  Wasn't a Gilbert, but was still impressive and large.  Had it's own table, with a sink.  Granted the water supply was a gallon jug and it drained into bucket.  I had the ingredients to make black powder, which, of course, I made. 

That sounds like the setup in 'The Big Golden Book of Chemistry'. It was an illustrated guide how to set up your own lab.

I don't recall a chemistry set that extensive. Maybe from an educational supply house?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, my space fantasy game rules are officially on hold right now.  Mongoose Publishing is going to release an SRD of their 2nd Edition Traveller rules under the ORC license. They are keeping the Community Content license to run in parallel with the ORC license.   It's just as well, I've been "on hold" for about a year anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now