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Scotty

Story, Wednesday July 26, 2017

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13 minutes ago, Stature said:

An obligatory "first try" flashback.

Such a mentor, such a mom. *sniff*

Considering the glove stored the parameters of the spell, it's possible that Tedd just overestimated things. Kinda like how Elliot tends to have difficulty getting details right.

The watch in question was a dynamic morph, but it might have had 2 spells working in conjunction? Like one that changed physical size and one that adjusted the fit of clothing. Tedd wouldn't have known he'd be imbuing the watch with multiple spells but it could be possible right?

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44 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The watch in question was a dynamic morph, but it might have had 2 spells working in conjunction? Like one that changed physical size and one that adjusted the fit of clothing. Tedd wouldn't have known he'd be imbuing the watch with multiple spells but it could be possible right?

Yes, it had. If it were not for the clothing dynamic, the clothes would not be as form-fitting as possible.

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Using a dynamic morph isn't necessarily something Tedd would be inherently good at. Making a wand, as a seer, is more of a natural talent (or so it seems).

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Shouldn't they test it before they celebrate?  If it's anything like what I get the first time the compiler stops barking, it'll turn people into Uryuoms...

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5 hours ago, Stature said:

Yes, it had. If it were not for the clothing dynamic, the clothes would not be as form-fitting as possible.

The reason I referenced Elliot and his morphs was that it's not so much the spells involved that are the issue, but the person trying to use the spells, The spells Tedd put on the watch for the dynamic morphs would have been just fine, but the tinkering to get the spells to create specific results plus the fact that the user would need to concentrate well enough to make sure the result they want is what they get.

1 hour ago, WR...S said:

Shouldn't they test it before they celebrate?  If it's anything like what I get the first time the compiler stops barking, it'll turn people into Uryuoms...

I'm sure Tedd will try it out just because, but I don't take what he said in the last panel as uncertainty that he actually did it. He was likely referencing what he said earlier about things he did working right the first time. Whether Tedd perceived Pandora's "You did it!" as surprise or encouragement, his response to that would sound like "Yeah, we've already established that it's natural for me". And it's not just the glove, Tedd mentioned previously that he would make intuitive leaps that kept turning out to be right when he was researching magic.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Scotty said:

And it's not just the glove, Tedd mentioned previously that he would make intuitive leaps that kept turning out to be right when he was researching magic.

Could it be that it's not all intuition? Could Tedd be changing magic? That could fit that all-so-secret second purpose of seers. It could also explain why Edward never heard of the magic-eating interdimesional whales: No wizard could see them until Tedd changed magic enough for him to see them.

Edited by Tom Sewell
Space Whales

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7 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Could it be that it's not all intuition? Could Tedd be changing magic? That could fit that all-so-secret second purpose of seers. It could also explain why Edward never heard of the magic-eating interdimesional whales: No wizard could see them until Tedd changed magic enough for him to see them.

I figured Tedd could see the whales because he can see magic, and a wizard like edward who can not see magic would not be able to see them, so no knowledge. 

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1 minute ago, Sjmcc13 said:

I figured Tedd could see the whales because he can see magic, and a wizard like edward who can not see magic would not be able to see them, so no knowledge.

Perhaps. But even if Edward can't see magic himself, as Tedd once said, his Dad is basically Dumbledore and knows barrels of stuff, most of which he keeps secret. He's the most likely human to know about seers, and it's guaranteed that he's invested a lot of effort in research about what makes Tedd Tedd. If Edward does know the second purpose of a seer, it would give him the kind of justification to lie to Tedd about knowing about the Space Whales. Hey, they can't be much more exotic than the Deathless Army of Rage.

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Tedd required a significant power boost to actually see the Whales. It's very well possible that the power required (and the possibility that a seer is needed) made it so that said species was virtually (or totally) unknown to wizards.

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There was no fake seizure.

When Edward said he didn't know, then he did not know.

Of course, there have been no more whale sightings of which we know.  Have the government's "Top Men" been studying the whales behind our backs?  If Edward reported this, with the expectation that someone else would look into it, then he may have requested to kept out of the loop on the investigation and preliminary findings so that he would not need to lie to Tedd.

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2 hours ago, JainaEgo said:

Tedd required a significant power boost to actually see the Whales.

Or: Tedd thought he needed a power boost. I think now that the gauntlet Tedd made (and maybe Lord Tedd's gauntlet as well) is about as necessary as the glove Tedd's been using when he enchants his watches. What he was doing to see the whales was, after all, seeing the whales. He wasn't so much using a new spell as concentrating very hard on doing the most basic thing his magic does.

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Just now, Tom Sewell said:

Could it be that it's not all intuition? Could Tedd be changing magic? That could fit that all-so-secret second purpose of seers. It could also explain why Edward never heard of the magic-eating interdimesional whales: No wizard could see them until Tedd changed magic enough for him to see them.

The thing is, it turned out to not be intuition, Tedd just assumed he was guessing at how magic worked. Tedd described what he sees as auras with subtle and major variations, if the first time Tedd saw a spell being cast and was like "it looks like it's doing x with y and maybe you can do z as well" and then z turns out to be right, then that knowledge must have come some somewhere. Tedd doesn't see words but is still able to decode the meaning of the auras instantly, but because Tedd didn't know that he had that special ability, he just assumed that the decoded information were "it COULD be this" rather than "it IS this". Like Pandora said, many Seers go about the lives doing Seer things without even knowing that it's out of the ordinary, they just figure it's someone they can do because it was tailored for them. Tedd only started questioning things because he always assumed he shouldn't have been able to resist enchantments or disenchant himself and such.

 

Just now, Tom Sewell said:

Or: Tedd thought he needed a power boost. I think now that the gauntlet Tedd made (and maybe Lord Tedd's gauntlet as well) is about as necessary as the glove Tedd's been using when he enchants his watches. What he was doing to see the whales was, after all, seeing the whales. He wasn't so much using a new spell as concentrating very hard on doing the most basic thing his magic does.

I figured that the gauntlet was a fancier, more technical type of spell catalyst, like the watches, but actually able to hold power, and allows Tedd to cast various programed spells. I dunno what kind of spell he would have used in that case, but it apparently amplified his vision to see beyond normal human vision, either another plane of reality, or the whale was just out of phase in the main reality. I dunno if that's a Seer ability or if Tedd saw someone cast a spell that he then based the gauntlet spell on.

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47 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Or: Tedd thought he needed a power boost. I think now that the gauntlet Tedd made (and maybe Lord Tedd's gauntlet as well) is about as necessary as the glove Tedd's been using when he enchants his watches. What he was doing to see the whales was, after all, seeing the whales. He wasn't so much using a new spell as concentrating very hard on doing the most basic thing his magic does.

Perhaps, but it seems more likely that it was the tool he created that allowed him to do it.

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3 minutes ago, JainaEgo said:

Perhaps, but it seems more likely that it was the tool he created that allowed him to do it.

Tedd just enchanted that wand without his glove. He didn't think he could do it until Pandora told him to try. Tedd thought he needed the glove, but he really doesn't. Kind of like taking the training wheels off your first bike.

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1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Tedd just enchanted that wand without his glove. He didn't think he could do it until Pandora told him to try. Tedd thought he needed the glove, but he really doesn't. Kind of like taking the training wheels off your first bike.

More like finding out you didn't need the training wheels in the first place.

Although the glove does allow Tedd to fine tune what the spells do, so it's not like he has to stop using it.

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2 hours ago, Scotty said:

I figured that the gauntlet was a fancier, more technical type of spell catalyst, like the watches, but actually able to hold power, and allows Tedd to cast various programed spells. I dunno what kind of spell he would have used in that case, but it apparently amplified his vision to see beyond normal human vision, either another plane of reality, or the whale was just out of phase in the main reality. I dunno if that's a Seer ability or if Tedd saw someone cast a spell that he then based the gauntlet spell on.

I wonder what the glove actually does in combat mode.  It feeds stored energy back to Tedd.  But Tedd already has access to lots of energy, as evidenced by the glowing and the fact that he not only placed a spell in a wand, the empowered the wand (and with practice, could place as much power in the wand as it could hold, I presume limited by the quality, mass, material of the wand).  So he is not lacking for power for certain things.  I think using the glove for combat mode is a dangerous thing for Tedd, perhaps pushing his abilities in ways they are not meant to be used.  This might even be an additional explanation for how off-kilter Lord Tedd seems to be.  It would be helpful I think, since Pandora is in mentor mode, for Tedd to ask about this and the Whales.

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6 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Perhaps. But even if Edward can't see magic himself, as Tedd once said, his Dad is basically Dumbledore and knows barrels of stuff, most of which he keeps secret. He's the most likely human to know about seers, and it's guaranteed that he's invested a lot of effort in research about what makes Tedd Tedd. If Edward does know the second purpose of a seer, it would give him the kind of justification to lie to Tedd about knowing about the Space Whales. Hey, they can't be much more exotic than the Deathless Army of Rage.

Obviously I could be wrong, but I really don't think Edward knows about Tedd being a seer or even having magic except for the ambient magic as power source and some kind of intuitive grasp to ensorcel the watches; I think that he truly believes his son is magic impaired and has decided to accept his son as he "is", and hasn't bothered to research Tedd; perhaps doing what could be seen as the opposite of what Noriko did.  I think that this colors his perceptions as well; he sees Tedd as needing protection, to the point of coddling him.

Of course, as I write this, I see the flaw in this argument about Edward not researching what makes Tedd tick.  A lot of what Tedd does shouldn't make sense to Edward.  I absolutely can't imagine he wouldn't have had the glove analyzed and tested (discovering it doesn't work for anyone else), unless Tedd never told him about the glove, but then Edward would want to know how Tedd makes the watches.  Also, an intuitive grasp of magic?  Shouldn't that be investigation worthy?  But I really feel like he has kept Tedd away from anyone knowing too much about what Tedd does, to prevent Tedd from being poked and prodded Dad's Government Business.

Hmm, so, in conclusion, I have argued myself into a corner.  Bottomline, I don't think Edward knows that Tedd is a seer, and I would bet the Feds don't know much of anything about Tedd at all.  If Edward has researched Tedd, I bet it has been clandestine and off the books.

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20 minutes ago, Tuscahoma said:

I think using the glove for combat mode is a dangerous thing for Tedd, perhaps pushing his abilities in ways they are not meant to be used.

I think so for a different reason: If Lord Tedd believes he needs that gauntlet for combat, taking it away from it could make him helpless. If General Shade Tail knows this, he has a way to disarm Lord Tedd. And if the General knows what's going on with our Tedd, it would become very important to keep our Tedd and Lord Tedd from comparing notes.

Something else occurs to me. General Shade Tail may have same morphing abilities comparable to Grace's. If he comes to the Moperverse, he could potentially look like anyone. Maybe the vampire mercenaries won't be the only unwelcome visitors this evening...

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17 hours ago, Scotty said:

So...question.

Those times that Tedd was glowing (aside from when he used his insight on his insight) what was the glowing for? Was he casting spells without realizing it?

Very good question. His glowing is obviously somehow linked to his seer abilities, but it seems that Dan is waiting for something before describing what EXACTLY it is. I was commenting that it is related to him realizing something, but this last case doesn't really fit ...

10 hours ago, Scotty said:
16 hours ago, Stature said:

Yes, it had. If it were not for the clothing dynamic, the clothes would not be as form-fitting as possible.

The reason I referenced Elliot and his morphs was that it's not so much the spells involved that are the issue, but the person trying to use the spells, The spells Tedd put on the watch for the dynamic morphs would have been just fine, but the tinkering to get the spells to create specific results plus the fact that the user would need to concentrate well enough to make sure the result they want is what they get.

Actually, the transformation spell on watches likely ARE based on Elliot's spells and seems they shared their weakness - meaning, they are very generic but hard to get right.

10 hours ago, Scotty said:
12 hours ago, WR...S said:

Shouldn't they test it before they celebrate?  If it's anything like what I get the first time the compiler stops barking, it'll turn people into Uryuoms...

I'm sure Tedd will try it out just because, but I don't take what he said in the last panel as uncertainty that he actually did it. He was likely referencing what he said earlier about things he did working right the first time. Whether Tedd perceived Pandora's "You did it!" as surprise or encouragement, his response to that would sound like "Yeah, we've already established that it's natural for me". And it's not just the glove, Tedd mentioned previously that he would make intuitive leaps that kept turning out to be right when he was researching magic.

My first idea when reading it was if he suspect Pandora somehow helped him to encourage him.

5 hours ago, JainaEgo said:

Tedd required a significant power boost to actually see the Whales. It's very well possible that the power required (and the possibility that a seer is needed) made it so that said species was virtually (or totally) unknown to wizards.

Yes. I think that Whales are just that hard to see, on top of rarely staying around humans for long.

3 hours ago, Scotty said:

Tedd doesn't see words but is still able to decode the meaning of the auras instantly, but because Tedd didn't know that he had that special ability, he just assumed that the decoded information were "it COULD be this" rather than "it IS this". Like Pandora said, many Seers go about the lives doing Seer things without even knowing that it's out of the ordinary, they just figure it's someone they can do because it was tailored for them. Tedd only started questioning things because he always assumed he shouldn't have been able to resist enchantments or disenchant himself and such.

Any seer which would do as much research as Tedd would start questioning how it's possible he's THAT good in it ... but most seers are not doing that much research.

3 hours ago, Scotty said:

I dunno if that's a Seer ability or if Tedd saw someone cast a spell that he then based the gauntlet spell on.

If his glasses are magic and not technology, maybe he used THAT knowledge ...

1 hour ago, Scotty said:

Although the glove does allow Tedd to fine tune what the spells do, so it's not like he has to stop using it.

It also connects him with computer. Without the glove, he would need to remember everything about the spell he is putting in watches. With glove, he can easily have megabytes of informations prepared.

26 minutes ago, Tuscahoma said:

I wonder what the glove actually does in combat mode.  It feeds stored energy back to Tedd.  But Tedd already has access to lots of energy, as evidenced by the glowing and the fact that he not only placed a spell in a wand, the empowered the wand (and with practice, could place as much power in the wand as it could hold, I presume limited by the quality, mass, material of the wand).  So he is not lacking for power for certain things.  I think using the glove for combat mode is a dangerous thing for Tedd, perhaps pushing his abilities in ways they are not meant to be used.  This might even be an additional explanation for how off-kilter Lord Tedd seems to be.  It would be helpful I think, since Pandora is in mentor mode, for Tedd to ask about this and the Whales.

Just because it's feeding Tedd with gigantic amount of energy (maybe) doesn't mean it's dangerous for him.

Also yes totally good idea to ask Pandora about the whales.

12 minutes ago, Tuscahoma said:

Obviously I could be wrong, but I really don't think Edward knows about Tedd being a seer or even having magic except for the ambient magic as power source and some kind of intuitive grasp to ensorcel the watches; I think that he truly believes his son is magic impaired and has decided to accept his son as he "is", and hasn't bothered to research Tedd; perhaps doing what could be seen as the opposite of what Noriko did.  I think that this colors his perceptions as well; he sees Tedd as needing protection, to the point of coddling him.

Of course, as I write this, I see the flaw in this argument about Edward not researching what makes Tedd tick.  A lot of what Tedd does shouldn't make sense to Edward.  I absolutely can't imagine he wouldn't have had the glove analyzed and tested (discovering it doesn't work for anyone else), unless Tedd never told him about the glove, but then Edward would want to know how Tedd makes the watches.  Also, an intuitive grasp of magic?  Shouldn't that be investigation worthy?  But I really feel like he has kept Tedd away from anyone knowing too much about what Tedd does, to prevent Tedd from being poked and prodded Dad's Government Business.

Hmm, so, in conclusion, I have argued myself into a corner.  Bottomline, I don't think Edward knows that Tedd is a seer, and I would bet the Feds don't know much of anything about Tedd at all.  If Edward has researched Tedd, I bet it has been clandestine and off the books.

He likely reports everything, but also likely isn't thinking about it much. I was speculating that there is some researcher who is trying to duplicate Tedd's work and doesn't know why it's so hard ... or, maybe everything goes on file and noone is really looking at it yet ...

Edward may not be "scientist", he might not realize how weird what Tedd is doing is and instead assume that it's basically what other researchers are doing, but other researchers are using wand-creating wands and similar stuff.

Specifically about glove ... I think he knows about glove and thinks Tedd was right when he said it's technology. Apparently, noone tried to verify it yet. He may not know about the gauntlet, however.

5 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

And if the General knows what's going on with our Tedd, it would become very important to keep our Tedd and Lord Tedd from comparing notes.

Very important for General Shade Tail you mean, right?

6 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

Something else occurs to me. General Shade Tail may have same morphing abilities comparable to Grace's. If he comes to the Moperverse, he could potentially look like anyone. Maybe the vampire mercenaries won't be the only unwelcome visitors this evening...

He certainly does, because Lespuko blood was planned part of the project and Lord Tedd likely also has TF gun.

However, I don't think he will be visiting anytime soon. Remember, Lord Tedd story arc was waaay premature to start.

 

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1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Remember, Lord Tedd story arc was waaay premature to start.

But how many years ago was it way premature?  Could we be getting close to when it is no longer premature?

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4 minutes ago, Tuscahoma said:

Of course, as I write this, I see the flaw in this argument about Edward not researching what makes Tedd tick.  A lot of what Tedd does shouldn't make sense to Edward.  I absolutely can't imagine he wouldn't have had the glove analyzed and tested (discovering it doesn't work for anyone else), unless Tedd never told him about the glove, but then Edward would want to know how Tedd makes the watches.  Also, an intuitive grasp of magic?  Shouldn't that be investigation worthy?  But I really feel like he has kept Tedd away from anyone knowing too much about what Tedd does, to prevent Tedd from being poked and prodded Dad's Government Business.

One thing I can think of that can support Edward not thinking anything odd about the glove and watches would be the magic analysis wand, it looks like an electronic device, even has a pop-out piece that covers where batteries go. Who ever made it was either a Seer like Tedd, or maybe there actually is a way to make magitech devices and Edward assumed that Tedd was able to figure out how to make them as well, maybe Edward just figured that Tedd reverse engineered the Uryuom tech.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Very good question. His glowing is obviously somehow linked to his seer abilities, but it seems that Dan is waiting for something before describing what EXACTLY it is. I was commenting that it is related to him realizing something, but this last case doesn't really fit ...

Something just occurred to me, and this is at the moment a wild theory, but what if those other glow incidents are related to Tedd's second purpose? Two of those moments were in relation to very strong positive emotions. Voltaire's been trying to traumatize or otherwise entice very strong negative emotions from Tedd to worsen the outcome of his hidden purpose. I should be safe to assume that the strong positive emotions would make for a better outcome. The best analogy that I can think of would be the Light and Dark sides of the Force and Voltaire's trying to get Tedd to go Dark Side.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Actually, the transformation spell on watches likely ARE based on Elliot's spells and seems they shared their weakness - meaning, they are very generic but hard to get right.

I'm not entirely sure it would make a difference whether Tedd based the transformation watches on Elliot's morphing or anyone else morphing I think the spell would be the same or at least very similar no matter who had it. The results of the spell wouldn't be so much dependent on the spell itself, but the caster being able to focus on the form well enough to get it right. Elliot has a hard time getting his forms right because he's trying to focus on a lot of detail, plus it's easy to distract him and sabotage the results. Susan did a better job of keeping her clothes fitting well enough probably because she's just better at focusing on what she wants, while Nanase....obviously didn't.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

Any seer which would do as much research as Tedd would start questioning how it's possible he's THAT good in it ... but most seers are not doing that much research.

I think you give Tedd too much credit, yeah Tedd should have questioned it more, but remember, he didn't like the idea that his parents might have been wrong about him, so he tried to think up other ways to justify how he could do certain things.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

If his glasses are magic and not technology, maybe he used THAT knowledge ...

I don't know for certain if the glasses were magically made or just high-tech, everyone thought they let him analyze magic but even he admitted that they only made him look scientific(even Dan states in the commentary that the glasses were an intentional misdirection), so... I think at this point...

akm.jpg?m=1309298056

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:

It also connects him with computer. Without the glove, he would need to remember everything about the spell he is putting in watches. With glove, he can easily have megabytes of informations prepared.

That's what I mean by fine tuning, the watches that have specific forms and such would have a lot of details that Tedd would code in by computer and transfer to the glove, and then once those are imbued into the watch would allow the user to just think "Grace 1", rather than having to actually picture what Grace looks like. The dynamic morphs probably only have a few parameters to make sure certain thing do or don't happen, but for the most part rely on the person to properly picture how they want to look.

Also, and this is just a theory, but what if the size limitation that Tedd has isn't necessarily because he's only seen someone cast a spell that shrank or grew someone a specific size. But because he's basing those kinds of watches on the limits of spells that only have size adjustments as a portion of the spell effect? For instance, Tedd watches Elliot transform, he loses 4 inches in height due to the form itself but it's not an actual shrink spell being applied, Tedd sees that a resize happens but it's not quite the same as it would be if Rhoda had used her resize spell. So Tedd has to try to separate the resize from the rest of the spell and fill in any blanks that results. It works but it's limited. If Tedd were to see Rhoda's resize spell in action, he should see exactly what those missing bits should be.

1 hour ago, hkmaly said:
1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Something else occurs to me. General Shade Tail may have same morphing abilities comparable to Grace's. If he comes to the Moperverse, he could potentially look like anyone. Maybe the vampire mercenaries won't be the only unwelcome visitors this evening...

He certainly does, because Lespuko blood was planned part of the project and Lord Tedd likely also has TF gun.

Yeah I don't doubt that General Shade Tail has the same control of his morphing ability as Grace does, and could likely pass as a stranger on the street easily enough, but I don't expect to see him impersonating Edward or Greg or anyone else we know because that would require clone forms of people that may not exist in Lord Tedd universe or not even look the same (Lord Tedd seems to be taller than our Tedd for instance), in order for it to work, they'd have to somehow scan someone from the main universe and that's even assuming Lord Tedd has access to a TFG and scanner. Also, Dan's already stated that if he has anyone impersonating anyone, there'd be clues, we'd have a chance to figure it out ahead of time if someone wasn't who they claimed to be. Then again, considering all the potential stories one could make involving someone impersonating another, we'll probably now expect any impersonator to be General Shade Tail. ;)

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22 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Yeah I don't doubt that General Shade Tail has the same control of his morphing ability as Grace does,

I'm not so certain.  The people who created Grace and Vladia didn't use a TFG on them to stabilize their transformations.  Either they didn't know about the effect it would have, or they didn't have access to a CMD to use on them.  The group that made General Shade Tail may have had similar limitations; whoever had a CMD available may have chosen to take it off-planet or destroy it rather than allow it to fall into his hands.

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