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Scotty

Np, Monday October 2, 2017

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Sooo, Nanase is still child? Well it SHOULD revert in few days ...

18 minutes ago, Scotty said:

Just gonna take a stab at this and say Ashley's somehow involved.

How? Sure, this isn't canon, but still, Ashley shouldn't have any magic.

Also, would totally try in real life, despite the high likehood they wouldn't actually learn from that experience.

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44 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Also, would totally try in real life, despite the high likehood they wouldn't actually learn from that experience.

If this happened in real life, they'd most likely panic, and so would I for that matter at such a sudden change.

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2 hours ago, partner555 said:
3 hours ago, hkmaly said:

Also, would totally try in real life, despite the high likehood they wouldn't actually learn from that experience.

If this happened in real life, they'd most likely panic, and so would I for that matter at such a sudden change.

First, they do seem to panic. Second, so what? They deserve it.

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

What really made this comic for me was the ellipsis of hesitation between "reproductive" and "rights?"

What ellipsis?

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Also nice was that the old man not only got changed into a woman, but a woman of color.

... funny how can we say this confidently despite the comics being grayscale :)

I suppose next set of laws they wanted to talk about has something to do with "immigration".

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Note to self: Do not associate a random tan-skinned brunette with Grace. Associate it with Rhoda, who makes the most works these days. /s

Ah look, found the Fountain of Feminine Youth. :demonicduck: 

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8 hours ago, hkmaly said:

How? Sure, this isn't canon, but still, Ashley shouldn't have any magic.

That's why I said "somehow" I'm not entirely sure how myself but I can only think that since Ashley's the last person Hanma needs to talk to, then this would have to be a lead up to it.

I did make a guess on Discord that maybe Dan's about to confirm that Elliot can now transform other people since Dan confirmed that everything Rhoda did earlier was stuff she can do in canon. But now that I think about it, maybe Dan's going to confirm that Liz got marked after all and that this transformation was her doing?

Dan could easily either have Ashley with Elliot which would open up some callbacks to the first Goonmanji NP,  since Elliot was involved with that, he could be the one to encourage Ashley to participate in Hanma's game. But Ashley could also be with Liz doing things.

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9 hours ago, hkmaly said:

How? Sure, this isn't canon, but still, Ashley shouldn't have any magic.

That we know of, but back in Moperverse October (in Marker) Pandora really, really wanted to give Ashley a mark, but didn't feel it was right. But now, she could find justification, such as she really likes Ashley and realizes that since she'll be close to Elliot, who has been targetted by another Immortal, Ashley could use some extra protection.

Also, it is in canon that you don't need to get a magic mark to get magic. I get the vibe that Ashley could have the magic potential in her family. The deliberate evasion of her parents pretending they don't know where they're ancestors came from (but nevertheless told her it surely wasn't Japan, which is supposed to have been founded by a Majo named Himeko.) kind of supports them hiding a big secret for her own good.

Plus I'm an Ashley fan. I'd like her to have more than a cameo or two in this story arc. And in EGS, there is no such thing as too much tranformation.

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57 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:
10 hours ago, hkmaly said:

How? Sure, this isn't canon, but still, Ashley shouldn't have any magic.

That we know of, but back in Moperverse October (in Marker) Pandora really, really wanted to give Ashley a mark, but didn't feel it was right. But now, she could find justification, such as she really likes Ashley and realizes that since she'll be close to Elliot, who has been targetted by another Immortal, Ashley could use some extra protection.

Also, it is in canon that you don't need to get a magic mark to get magic. I get the vibe that Ashley could have the magic potential in her family. The deliberate evasion of her parents pretending they don't know where they're ancestors came from (but nevertheless told her it surely wasn't Japan, which is supposed to have been founded by a Majo named Himeko.) kind of supports them hiding a big secret for her own good.

Plus I'm an Ashley fan. I'd like her to have more than a cameo or two in this story arc. And in EGS, there is no such thing as too much tranformation.

I think it's less her parents deliberately evading the question and more lack of interest. She said her family has been in America for generations. Not all families have a deep interest in their heritage, especially as they get more generationally distant from that original culture. Also, based on the commentary on this page, Ashley has a widespread heritage from multiple Asian nations, so listing where she doesn't have heritage might be the simpler route.

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2 hours ago, Drasvin said:

I think it's less her parents deliberately evading the question and more lack of interest. She said her family has been in America for generations. Not all families have a deep interest in their heritage, especially as they get more generationally distant from that original culture. Also, based on the commentary on this page, Ashley has a widespread heritage from multiple Asian nations, so listing where she doesn't have heritage might be the simpler route.

Well, giving Ashley a generic Asian background might be just what Dan said it was: A way to avoid panels upon panels upon panels of explanation of something that he didn't see as that important to the story. But it's been a long time in our world since he made those comments and Dan could have either changed his mind about Ashley's heritage, or have played us back then to set up a big reveal later on. Nah, Dan would never do things like that, would he?

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4 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

That we know of, but back in Moperverse October (in Marker) Pandora really, really wanted to give Ashley a mark, but didn't feel it was right. But now, she could find justification, such as she really likes Ashley and realizes that since she'll be close to Elliot, who has been targetted by another Immortal, Ashley could use some extra protection.

Pandora, historically at least, never asks herself if she should do a thing.  Only if it sounds like it would be fun.

It was Ashley's own nature that prevented Pandora from Marking her.  She really is that goodie two-shoes.

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42 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

But it's been a long time in our world since he made those comments and Dan could have either changed his mind about Ashley's heritage, or have played us back then to set up a big reveal later on. Nah, Dan would never do things like that, would he?

There would be more foreshadowing before it becomes relevant. Dan likes his foreshadowing.

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1 hour ago, Vorlonagent said:

Pandora, historically at least, never asks herself if she should do a thing.  Only if it sounds like it would be fun.

It was Ashley's own nature that prevented Pandora from Marking her.  She really is that goodie two-shoes.

So Pandora risked her son's life for fun?

Pandora's explanation of why she couldn't give Ashley transformation spells began with a statement that Ashley's essential goodness conflicted with those spells. In the next comic, explains that because Ashley's desire for transformation magic isn't a natural affinity while her goodness is.

But Pandora isn't finished. She says that she could give Ashley spells for sharing feelings. It occurs to me that sharing feelings with a vampire that has no empathy could cause said vampire pain, something like holy water burning a demon.

Also, Pandora begins her thoughtbox in the second panel about spells she actually could give Ashley with "meanwhile." Dan may have put this qualifier in to say that while Ashley couldn't get transformation spells at the time, she might later. And, of course, the main story has progressed more than two Moperverse months into later.

And two more strips later, Pandora says to herself that she could give Liz a spell that wasn't what Pandora had in mind, but had many ways that spell could wind up helping. However, Dan didn't let Pandora tell us what that spell was. And that's the last of Liz we see in Marker.

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6 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

It occurs to me that sharing feelings with a vampire that has no empathy could cause said vampire pain, something like holy water burning a demon.

I doubt share feelings with a being that lacks empathy would harm it. Sharing feelings doesn't seem like something that would disrupt the magic that sustains the vampires. I think the loss of empathy is less a sustaining aspect of vampirism and more a side effect of becoming a parasitic monster obsessed with living forever. More likely it would just confuse the empathy-less being, which could still be handy in a fight.

Then again, mixing different magics together leads to unexpected results, even with fairly simply interactions like with Rhoda's and Catalina's spells in Escape from the Mall, so who knows what would happen.

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2 minutes ago, Drasvin said:

Then again, mixing different magics together leads to unexpected results, even with fairly simply interactions like with Rhoda's and Catalina's spells in Escape from the Mall, so who knows what would happen.

Maybe combined with Ashley's unbearable niceness--too nice for Nanase--Ashley could actually be able to cure vampires. That would be a real game-changer; it's something that wasn't in Edward's Endless Barrel of Exposition. It would also make Pandora wonder why she hadn't tried to find a cure for werewolves instead of killing them all. After all, that's what Abraham at least tried to do.

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1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

So Pandora risked her son's life for fun?

Probably not, agreed.  But she certainly didn't ask herself if she should have done it.  She's a creature of impulse with low impulse control.  Most of the time she's interested in what's fun or would be if she could arrange something whose outcome she couldn't predict.

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Pandora's explanation of why she couldn't give Ashley transformation spells began with a statement that Ashley's essential goodness conflicted with those spells. In the next comic, explains that because Ashley's desire for transformation magic isn't a natural affinity while her goodness is.

You write "affinity" and I read magical affinity.  Want to be sure I'm not misreading you.  Are you suggesting that Ashley's good nature is a magical aptitude? 

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

But Pandora isn't finished. She says that she could give Ashley spells for sharing feelings. It occurs to me that sharing feelings with a vampire that has no empathy could cause said vampire pain, something like holy water burning a demon.

I'm not sure it would do anything but annoy or distract.  But distracting at the right moment could be very useful.

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Also, Pandora begins her thoughtbox in the second panel about spells she actually could give Ashley with "meanwhile." Dan may have put this qualifier in to say that while Ashley couldn't get transformation spells at the time, she might later. And, of course, the main story has progressed more than two Moperverse months into later.

I didn't see Dan's usage of "meanwhile" to suggest the possibility of Ashley getting transformation spells, but that possibility is very much implicit in the "This girl is...absurd" comic so i agree with your conclusion.  I took Pandora as meaning "I can't give Ashley these spells I want to give her and at the same time I can give her spells that don't much interest me."

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

And two more strips later, Pandora says to herself that she could give Liz a spell that wasn't what Pandora had in mind, but had many ways that spell could wind up helping. However, Dan didn't let Pandora tell us what that spell was. And that's the last of Liz we see in Marker.

I too would be curious about what spell Pandora could did give Liz...  :)

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1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

So Pandora risked her son's life for fun?

No, Pandora risked her son's life for petty revenge.

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9 hours ago, Scotty said:

I did make a guess on Discord that maybe Dan's about to confirm that Elliot can now transform other people since Dan confirmed that everything Rhoda did earlier was stuff she can do in canon. But now that I think about it, maybe Dan's going to confirm that Liz got marked after all and that this transformation was her doing?

Wasn't Liz's mark supposed to be something with not pretending? Also, I sort of expect that if Dan didn't said what spell Liz got in EFTM he is keeping it as big reveal in main story, why would it appear now, outside canon?

And, yes, if Elliot can transform someone else it would be first time.

8 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

That we know of, but back in Moperverse October (in Marker) Pandora really, really wanted to give Ashley a mark, but didn't feel it was right.

Pandora really, really wanted to give Ashley a TRANSFORMATION mark but COULDN'T because Ashley is too good to use such spell. She COULD give her some healing but that was useless to her.

2 hours ago, Tom Sewell said:

Dan may have put this qualifier in to say that while Ashley couldn't get transformation spells at the time, she might later. And, of course, the main story has progressed more than two Moperverse months into later.

I suspect Ashley only really changed by meeting Elliot - meaning, she might be markable with transformation spells NOW but because Pandora already stopped marking left right ...

1 hour ago, Tom Sewell said:

Maybe combined with Ashley's unbearable niceness--too nice for Nanase--Ashley could actually be able to cure vampires. That would be a real game-changer; it's something that wasn't in Edward's Endless Barrel of Exposition. It would also make Pandora wonder why she hadn't tried to find a cure for werewolves instead of killing them all. After all, that's what Abraham at least tried to do.

Sure it would be game changer but personally I think that having someone who main eight can kill without second guessing it will be better. Susan just started to get out of depression caused by killing one vampire, she doesn't need reason to get back. Also, I would guess that if Ashley had this kind of power Pandora would notice.

 

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1 minute ago, hkmaly said:

Wasn't Liz's mark supposed to be something with not pretending? Also, I sort of expect that if Dan didn't said what spell Liz got in EFTM he is keeping it as big reveal in main story, why would it appear now, outside canon?

She also said she didn't like just getting a taste of something and they get cut off from it, she didn't want to be teased with having something fun for a day. I can't think of anything that would apply to this situation, but there might be something. And I don't remember seeing Dan mention holding off on revealing what it was for the main story, so I would imagine he's free to reveal it whenever and wherever he wants.

11 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

Sure it would be game changer but personally I think that having someone who main eight can kill without second guessing it will be better. Susan just started to get out of depression caused by killing one vampire, she doesn't need reason to get back. Also, I would guess that if Ashley had this kind of power Pandora would notice.

The difference between aberrations and werewolves is that aberrations chose to become what they are, they don't want to be cured.

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17 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The difference between aberrations and werewolves is that aberrations chose to become what they are, they don't want to be cured.

As far as we know, there was only one "undying" wolf, the one that Abraham's enchanted diamond created. And "undying" doesn't necessarily mean "unaging." It could be taken as "humongously difficult to kill." And the living-for-centuries thing just isn't part of the werewolf meme.

There's a really touching short story about an old Superman who retains his superpowers but has become senile. He visits a very old Lois Lane in some kind of nursing home and thinks she must be Martha Kent.

Anyway, what I'm thinking of as a "cure" is restoring the empathy of a vampire and removing their vampiric powers without killing them. This is not to say turning them into saints, but giving them an opportunity to redeem themselves without compelling them to.

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18 minutes ago, Scotty said:

And I don't remember seeing Dan mention holding off on revealing what it was for the main story, so I would imagine he's free to reveal it whenever and wherever he wants.

That's technically true, but I still think that there is reason why he didn't revealed it right away and this doesn't seem like better place.

19 minutes ago, Scotty said:

The difference between aberrations and werewolves is that aberrations chose to become what they are, they don't want to be cured.

Also this. They don't want to be cured now and they might not like being cured even after you do it.

8 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

As far as we know, there was only one "undying" wolf, the one that Abraham's enchanted diamond created. And "undying" doesn't necessarily mean "unaging." It could be taken as "humongously difficult to kill."

Where it was mentioned he was "undying"? Hard to kill, sure, but it may not be harder to kill than "normal" werewolves.

9 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

And the living-for-centuries thing just isn't part of the werewolf meme.

Werewolves in Underworld lived just as long as vampires and I vaguely remember several others, but yes, usually it's not mentioned.

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14 minutes ago, Tom Sewell said:

As far as we know, there was only one "undying" wolf, the one that Abraham's enchanted diamond created. And "undying" doesn't necessarily mean "unaging." It could be taken as "humongously difficult to kill." And the living-for-centuries thing just isn't part of the werewolf meme.

It was an "unwaking wolf" meaning it didn't have a human form to turn into during the day.

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