hkmaly

Well they already put lasers on ships. For ships it doesn't matter that it's size of a van and you can fire that much more cheaply than "normal" cannon, rocket or railgun (around Somalia, the price of ammunition is often bigger than price of target). (BTW, I suspect that it WOULD be possible for laser to be human-portable ... when you don't count energy source. The laser is pretty energy efficient, BUT you need the target hit with lot of energy.)

Finally something else to react to than "it can't work period". Hmmm ... I'm not sure if I emphasized it enough but yes, her having to CHOOSE to use the ability was one of my points. And, yes, unlike door, computer doesn't respond directly on mechanical force, instead it periodically (using it's internal timer) check if some circuit is closed. (Keyboard is basically grid and chip ; the chip periodically tries "column 1 row 1, not connected ; column 1 row 2, not connected ; column 1 row 3, not connected ..." ... which is why it sometimes fail to recognize what is pressed if you press multiple keys at once, especially if it's cheap keyboard.) It's not possible to use modify-the-simulation without decreasing the accuracy at all, but it IS possible to use in in way which decrease the accuracy only little. Like ... in the case of computer, you will likely decrease the accuracy less if you just make the electricity flowing from the wall than if you do something with computer directly. Knowing how things are supposed to work definitely helps, question is how detailed knowledge will be useful. Like, the fact that computer need electricity is part of knowing how it works, but pretty basic. Found it meanwhile and it was on tumblr: It’s the initial investment that’s so costly. Once it’s in her mind, there’s very little magic upkeep. When she uses the spell, however, it’s basically sending out a spherical wave of magic data gathering that has to make ridiculously detailed notes of everything it encounters. Note that "ridiculously" is not exact size, but it does suggest better-than-naked-eye-visible accuracy. Desktop computer requires external electricity, but notebook have battery. Cell phone or smartphone have battery, but BTS station (the thing phones connect to) likely requires external electricity (although they MIGHT have some sort of battery for emergencies). The rate difference is not going to turn multimegabyte optical cable into dial-up modem ; problem is that dial-up modem was last device actually able to set speed. On Ethernet cable, the available speeds are 10, 100 and 1000 - you can't connect at all if you are at 50. Also, I suspect that there can be NO connection from simulation to outside (or from outside to simulation) after the initial data gathering.

Unless, of course, you have data in /etc/hosts (or it's Windows equivalent) for the site in question. That's cache. It's manually managed cache but cache nevertheless. If google decide to move www.google.com, they won't contact you to change your entry ; they change their DNS server and will expect all caches to expire and update itself. In 5 minutes (that's the TTL of www.google.com A entry). Which shows how bad idea is to put www.google.com into /etc/hosts

I'm running bind. You can't get more "full" nameserver than that. But DNS is distributed: no single computer has whole tree. The root nameservers typically ONLY know who is authoritative for which top level domain. Not counting caches, you need to ask three computers before getting IP address of www.google.com (for example 198.41.0.4, 192.5.6.30 and 216.239.32.10, although you have multiple options to choose in each step).

Well, it's not like this discussion was going anywhere. I think the argument with soul was my last one and I would only repeat myself. I'm also basing my feelings on what Dan has already said is and isn't possible, but I must admit he didn't say enough ... We might get another evidence in Monday, but it's not likely it will be something which decide it. More likely we get more OT3 fuel and that's not something I would complain about

I don't, although I would make exception if the computer we talk about would be Data. Computers are mostly deterministic and closer to books than to people, IMHO - at least our computers, computers in sci-fi tend to be more advanced. (Also see the answer in other thread.) Well, it would be what I understand by "accurate". Of course, pending more information from Dan. There may be. I have one nameserver on every computer and one on router. While Sarah is unlikely to have such configuration at home, Tedd might, or possibly Edward has similar configuration for security purposes. That of course doesn't change the main part: she is definitely not able to retrieve real-world information from the Internet.

The reason I moved this portion here is because I once got warned by Hack about posting information from a new comic in the reaction thread of an older comic, I was trying to avoid that again. Yes, of course. It's just that it also have it's disadvantages. I don't have any reason which would satisfy materialist, but EGS is obviously not materialistic world, so the answer is simple: what person says depend not only on their biological brain, but also on their soul, and the simulation is not able to copy souls. Note that human brain is much more complicated than computer, so materialistic answer MIGHT be based on that, but it's not so satisfying: if there is some limit on complexity, it might be at any place. It IS possible that computers are too complex to work, it's just that it requires arbitrary limit and you can just as well speculate that old 80386-based computer will work and modern one wouldn't because it's just so happened that transistors smaller than 100nm can't be simulated, or the number of transistors might go over some limit. On the other hand, arbitrary limits exists. Her spell has some finite range which is also arbitrary. Arbitrary limits are also most likely to move with experience: her range is likely going to get bigger, so might the number of things she can keep "moving" (experiencing time) without faking it and endangering accuracy of simulation. Meanwhile, if reason she can't talk with real people is they have soul, it's hard limit she can't overcame even with Dex's pedant.

Those adults don't have the same proportions as normal-sized adults, often having bigger head (proportionally of course) for example. Also, their health is questionable. The size of their head might be more relevant to real limit than their height, considering we talk about proportional shrinking. Unfortunately, finding details about their body parts is harder than their height, but based on photos, I would expect Jyoti Amge's head having 14cm, which is more than half of standard head size of 20-23 centimetres. My first own laser was in mouse . And, yes, there are people in military with big budget who STILL don't have as huge lasers as they wanted as kids. EDIT: Ok, technically, I had laser in CD-ROM earlier, but I didn't tried to pick it apart, so I didn't actually saw it.

Yes, instruction. Not doing it instead of you. (Although ... showing how something can be done might be part of guiding ...) The pinup can still be canon, it just ends up happening after Rhoda and Catalina take that next step mutually. Yes. It would be when they decide it would be fun thing to try, not when they feel forced to do it for outside reasons. (Or, well, it was ... considering this is flashback ... note that Rhoda is using just one hand in that, suggesting more experience ...)

Please do not make statements that absolutist. It is rude. I also disagree with you. My own medical and biological knowledge is not all that great, and I can nonetheless make myself move properly. I do not see how I require a medical degree to imagine someone else moving. ... maybe moving the conversation between threads wasn't that good idea. We are debating Scotty's pretty absolute conviction that computer can't work in simulation because Sarah doesn't have necessary knowledge about microelectronic. I'm comparing that argument with saying that Grace can't move in simulation because Sarah doesn't have necessary knowledge of medicine and biology. I wasn't even thinking on THAT level. I was thinking about muscle contractions. Although yes, thinking about what exactly are you doing when you talk is harder than talking ... I agree that the first option is more interesting. Also, if the second would be true, Grace explaining something to Sarah the way she did would be sign of mental problems. I'm pretty sure I explained it multiple times already. There is no reason to assume she needs to know something about computers to make computer work in simulation, just like there is no reason to assume she needs to know about what proteins in muscles are responsible for Grace moving (it's actin and myosin, BTW). First, the spell may not really require this informations to emulate the actions. Second, as proved by Abraham's "modern knowledge" spell, there IS some "place" containing "common" knowledge the spell can get this information from. Also, the way Elliot interacted with his "merged" phone suggest the spell was able to translate informations provided by phone to provide them differently. It wasn't using physical microphone, speaker or screen of the phone, it emulated them inside Elliot's mind. So, if the Cheerleadra spell can do it, why not Sarah's? (Which reminds me, we will likely not see Sarah using desktop computer in simulation, but she might try her phone ; I would mention in advance that smartphone is technically computer.) Agree, any "Box" Sarah would converse with in the simulation wouldn't be connected with real Pandora. Although I suspect Pandora herself would prefer if there would be some option for it ... On the other hand, there ARE data in her subconscious which her conscious never evaluated. It's not just about the way he thinks about it ; for example, she might hear something she didn't payed attention to, but her subconscious could still extract memory of it. I think Grace's behaviour in simulation could be more precise than what would Sarah expect consciously - but still based on what she knows about her.

Well, I was trying to describe a sort of sliding scale with objects with few parts which Sarah all understands being on one end and objects with millions of parts which Sarah mostly doesn't understand being on the other end. Most adults and teenagers understand the principles that make a mechanical clock work, even if they don't understand the job of every single cog or the numbers involved. Computers, on the other hand, are pretty opaque to anybody who hasn't taken college-level electrical engineering (at least in the "how do circuits perform the work" sense--programming a computer is simpler than designing that same computer). Designing modern CPU is something only few teams on whole planets are capable of doing, yes. But the basic principle is not that hard. Meanwhile, you might overestimate number of people who understand gears, as proved by this ad for example (and I saw several similar). Sure, there is difference: but as argument for while something is "surely not going to work" it's pretty weak. Ok, sonar itself is probably a bad example, I just wanted to use it as a reference for the fact that it can be an omnidirectional pulse used to create an image. Yes, it might be detailed enough to do pits and ridges for CD/DVD's, and Sarah could certainly open up a computer case and see all the parts, but actually getting it all to function accurately would require Sarah to have the technical knowledge of how all the parts work together and the instructions for each part. The reason it works with books is because it has physical pages that can be individually included in the image scan, and Sarah knows how to open a book and read. The CD/DVD/HDD/SSD could have a PDF version of that anatomy book she was looking for, but she has no clue what RPM the drive needs to spin at, how the read/write/optical heads are supposed to move, how the data is supposed to move along the buses and into and out of memory, and that's not including the fact that she doesn't know how a computer translates machine language into readable material. She doesn't need to. It's not a test, noone is asking her. In her experience with real world, it always just works ; therefore, it makes sense if it just works inside the simulation as well. See the comparison to Grace moving in other thread.

Not necessarily multitargeting, but encompassing, or rather, maybe more like how Amanda's shrink soda was supposed to work, and ended up working. Hmmmm ... I would argue that if Rhoda is not capable of encompassing, pumping more energy into her wouldn't solve that, but when I compare with Dex ... ... so, yes. Encompassing seem to be "advanced level" of her spell, which she can either do now because she was training and because the determination, or it can be done by pumping her with energy. It shouldn't be hard to obtain shopping bag in shop.

You basically says that the computer wouldn't retain content in RAM, but you could boot it from CD-ROM and it would work normally. (CD-ROM retaining information is covered by "anything she can look at with microscope is accurate".) Sarah doesn't have biology and medical knowledge to make Grace move "properly". If she moves regardless, it means your argument with what Sarah knows is invalid.

Of course her brain wouldn't be able to keep all that information. Of course the spell is still in progress, but the initial scan was basically a sonar pulse on steroids, it created an image of the area around Sarah, nothing more, there's no storage of the state of what's on RAM or whatever. Sonar on steroid wouldn't be able to record what's written in books either. Or do you think that RAM, SSD and HDD wouldn't be recorded and CD and DVD would? Because pits on CD and DVDs differs from books or cuneiform script only in size, and you CAN read it with microscope. Not saying it would, just saying that at least the devices would function on a computer simulation, it would require a fair but of programming to make it accurate, but doable. Sarah wouldn't have even that knowledge to make devices function accurately. stuff that she makes appear on the screen would be from her imagination. What knowledge Sarah have is irrelevant. Hmm, I read through that bit 3 times and can only believe that the "admin" just reported the guy to the actual admins just prior to sending the message and just said all that to make the other person feel better. She said she barely knows computers, but knows about all the social media sites, it'd be enough to report someone for abusive behaviour to all of them and have him banned. Heck it's probably something she could have got the ball rolling on before she arrived at that person's place. None of it really screams "OMG that's a super power!" Or she didn't do anything and just lie, right. Either you do believe what is she saying or you don't. And she says it's super power. Also, you can't ban someone from email. SMTP protocol is decentralized and doesn't support stuff like that.

Head was just one example that just came to mind when thinking about the question, though I do hope that aiming her palm at her foot never just affects the foot. But, aiming her palm to her chest when checking growing ... We have confirmed she can do A and C. She may not be able to do B. We also don't know what is the duration and therefore how practical would be to wait it out. Considering Voltaire was pumping extra power into Dex to allow him to summon bigger things. There is a possibility of Pandora giving Rhoda a bit of a boost. Energy boost wouldn't enable multitargeting. On the other hand ... PEOPLE are protected by the laws. It's possible that there is no similar protection of clothing and she can affect it without conditions Not true. She seems perpendicular to them, not behind any of them. Even if she would stay on same space when Catalina moved (or did Rhoda moved?) she would still not be behind Rhoda.

There isn't any truly free space inside human body. You can either shrink atoms, which makes them chemically incompatible with non-shrunk atoms, or remove atoms, which requires god power to do in human body without causing major damage. The cells aren't "marked" in any way, physical process wouldn't be able to do something as complicated as removed whole cells, and, as you mentioned, even that would be extremely bad idea. I think there are some ways where shrinking causes problems as well. Kleiber's law doesn't have the exact explanation like the problems with enlarging, so you might be right that it's not square-cube law doing it, it likely would affect shrunk people. For example, it's harder to keep body heat if you are smaller. (The question if those problems are serious enough to affect people on 50% height is open. You are definitely right that enlarging is problematic much more straightforwardly.)

Note that I did mentioned another option which could make computers works without simulating on electron level. Also, note that Elliot's ability to merge with his smartphone might be similarly OP. Nevertheless, Dan's comparison, while not exact information, is more relevant to what is canon than what YOU see as OP. Her brain wouldn't be able to keep all the informations in memory. Obviously, the spell is still in progress, and AT LEAST keeps all information AND makes the simulation not only feel but BE MUCH more real than any dream. Grace behaved VERY differently than vegetable. Sure, she wasn't behaving like GRACE, but she behaved as body with working brain. If the computer simulation will be based on general "modern knowledge", it might run normally and still fail to load top secret documents. Or, you know, perhaps Sarah would be able to load those top secret documents if she would get near such computer, but DGB and their equivalents in other countries can make sure she don't. In fact, government computers might be ENCHANTED to not work in such spell. Note, if you want to see truly OP power related to computers, look here.

Yes Apparently, she even managed to make the clothes shrink in EXACTLY same ratio. Although, while surprising, I still expect more hijinks. Does it look like empowering or guiding to you? I don't think Pandora would be ABLE to help. Not speaking about her wanting to just observe and be surprised. I'm not sure how far crickets can be heard, but given their size it's going to be notable as well. Why head? She can point to her chest, for example. In fact, this "palm-based" targeting is pretty inaccurate and has potential for hijinks. I think she would eventually be able to just will something to shrink, but doesn't have experience for it yet, which includes herself.

By not thinking about it? I know, you want the spell to be faking everything, but it is actually more likely that stuff will "just work" when she will NOT think about how they work to not make any changes by mistake. The spell can either just simulate it by moving atoms normally, or draw the information from outside - like, from the same place Abraham got modern knowledge when he de-petrified. (This modern knowledge was enough to make him able to travel without getting scared by iron horses or similar stuff, and speak modern English, but apparently didn't provided him with details about culture like the Mount Doom.) She might have the same kind of problems with keeping timing with pendulum as with quartz. Difference is, when mechanical clocks have irregular timing, they will show incorrect time, but work. Meanwhile, computer with irregular timing will have all sorts of problems: the timing of quartz must exactly match timing of how fast will signals move over buses. I simply don't agree with this. Which, given the canon doesn't provide enough information to confirm or reject it, you need to accept. She can lose even expectation-based game if her subconscious will be sabotaging it. Like, if she would EXPECT she will lose.

Oh my, what a picture. Back in the sixties Ray Palmer (The Atom) would occasionally shrink to the point where he could see individual atoms. Sometime after, I read George Gamov's Mr Thompkins stories, about an ordinary man who gets to see what happens when various physical constants, like the speed of light or Planck's constant, changed to the point where relativity or the uncertainty principle became palpable. Would that whoever was writing The Atom back then had read those stories. The comics would have been more entertaining, and I could have truthfully told Mom that I was learning something. :-) Would definitely be more interesting and would teach you something about physics, but it wouldn't be any more realistic. You can't see atom because you need photons to see and photons are "too big" (have too big wavelengths) for that. At least the photons which won't kill anyone around (except Hulk). Ray shrinking to 50% and not dying fast is already physically impossible due to various square-cube laws effects. If he's using magic like Rhoda ("sweet" magic), he can be just as able to avoid any unfortunate sideefects of shrinking under Schwarzschild radius. Yeah, Mall Girl was outside influence because Ashley made Elliot think of big boobs, but it's still Elliot thinking about it that affected the form, just like thinking about Grace and Ellen created Gracelyn and thinking about the Uryuom suits created Cheerleadra 2.0 Well, yes, obviously. She even stopped saying "big boobs" before the transformation itself. You're right, Gracelyn and Cheerleadra 2.0 are just as good examples. The examples which wouldn't be as good would be the "trying to stay correct height" ones, because that was just failure to imagine it properly, while we are looking for examples of thoughts which were not supposed to be part of concentration on the spell ending up influencing it.

Most people understand few gear wheels, but wouldn't actually be able to imagine all gears inside mechanical clocks correctly. Similarly, single transistor is easy to understand. So, no. The border between those is not as clear as you claim. There is still possibility the computer will not work - in fact, we don't have the clocks confirmed yet either - but it wouldn't be for this reason. Also, obviously, Grace is MUCH more complicated than computer and she still seems to work ... but, on the other hand, doesn't actually work as Grace, at least the brain doesn't. Maybe the true reason computer wouldn't work will be that only time which can pass in simulation is fake, with Sarah as it's source, and computer can't truly work without it's internal clock ticking ... Or maybe Dan will simply says that computers WILL work and left us wondering about details just like with Elliot smartphone merge. Sigh. Google datacenter is well outside range of simulation and google homepage is set to expire immediately (Cache-Control private, max-age 0, expires -1 ...). If google will load, we would know it's fake. The screen will likely be rendered in video memory completely, as part of scrolling acceleration. And the spell can scan video memory just as the pages, and it's already pre-rendered so no complicated computing is necessary. (Heh ... complicated ... as if the computing necessary would be harder than realistic movement of Grace's hair ...)

The bus would stop moving in the simulation. And if she willed it to start moving, then the same would happen if she walked to the edge of the 'snapshot' in the simulation, just she would get there much faster. Though I have no clue what would happen if she tries to move beyond the bounds of the spell's 'snapshot' We don't even know how the edges of simulation LOOKS. I mean, can she LOOK trough them (because photons necessary for it are inside simulation) or not? Would it crash into edges like it would be solid wall, or would it JUST stop, ignoring inertia? Sounds very OP. Perhaps something Sarah could think about if she actually awakens then. Yes. Seems like one possible "upgrade" for her spell. Although likely not her first spell after awakening, considering she might not be able to cast this spell then. While it might've been alarming compared to rest of world, I think it was NORMAL speed for Moperville magical anomaly. Scary? Well, depends on how many people Pandora marked ... Yes. It also suits her as artist, IMHO. I think "all the time" was closer to truth than "once". The different speed of time might be problem ... although, technically, dreams also don't work in real-time, so ... Maybe it's because she needs to enter at start, so she need to time it properly? Or maybe the spell has some internal protection ... Observing dream may be easier than entering awake mind.

Point of information, Tedd's default female form via just his magic mark with no extras applied has smaller boobs than Sarah. You mean the form which Sarah possibly saw but certainly didn't noticed it's woman? She missed the relevation. So, I'm not counting that.

Well, Elliot's standard female morph in general is apparently difficult for him to get exactly what he wants, which is why he opted to keep it a simple as possible for when he was burning off excess energy. I meant because it was outside influence which altered the morph. (Unless it would happen anyway like Elliot though.)

The door wasn't frozen ... or at least unfreezing them didn't endangered the accuracy. But, yes, it is possible that the more complicated machinery it is, the harder is to unfreeze it, and the effect is big enough to negate most quantum experiments. I think it will - like, not directly (we would need xkcd whatif for that) but we are likely to see more complicated stuff than opening door eventually. Unless she'll spend all time in simulation since now to the time the clog will be removed by making out, "hanky panky" etc ...