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      Welcome!   03/05/2016

      Welcome, everyone, to the new 910CMX Community Forums. I'm still working on getting them running, so things may change.  If you're a 910 Comic creator and need your forum recreated, let me know and I'll get on it right away.  I'll do my best to make this new place as fun as the last one!

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Yeah, those clothes would be loose enough she'd probably lose them.

Is anyone surprised that Ashley is a bit of an exhibitionist?

(I'd adjust Ashley's proposal to allow clothes to resize UP. Wearing mouse-size clothing after transformation to elephant-size could be uncomfortable - to put it mildly.)

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11 minutes ago, Don Edwards said:

.Is anyone surprised that Ashley is a bit of an exhibitionist?

 

9 minutes ago, The Old Hack said:

I am not precisely stunned, no. :danshiftyeyes:

I thought that was a canon given about her.

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2 hours ago, ChronosCat said:

It's all fun and games until someone looses their clothes. Then for some people, it's twice as fun.

Although I'm sure Susan would object. Actually, I'm not sure why she wasn't objected IN this comic.

2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

(I'd adjust Ashley's proposal to allow clothes to resize UP. Wearing mouse-size clothing after transformation to elephant-size could be uncomfortable - to put it mildly.)

"Wearing"? I would predict total wardrobe malfunction.

2 hours ago, Don Edwards said:

Is anyone surprised that Ashley is a bit of an exhibitionist?

What's surprising is she only had one relationship before Elliot with this attitude (well, two, but one was over internet). Although, maybe she's exhibitionist only when transformed?

She went with super cute, not deadly sexy for her date ...

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3 hours ago, partner555 said:

She's kinky as hell!

Kinky, sure, but pointless. Surely it is a waste of a good pair of pants.

Elephants, even. hehehehe...

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14 minutes ago, Pharaoh RutinTutin said:

At least Tedd and Sarah pretend that the loss of clothes in the lab is accidental.

Accidental, yes. Inevitable, no.

Also, Ashley pretends the loss of clothes is accidental too. She's just doing it poorly.

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Dan's doing this on purpose to give people fanfiction material isn't he? This is just like teasing Grace-Tedd-Sarah. Yeah, this isn't a canon storyline but the characters are in character,  something could happen in a canon setting, like now that magic is wide open and can be known, Ashley learns about Catalina's abilities since they go to the same school, then she learns of Rhoda's abilities and expresses a desire to be turned into a shrunken catgirl which Catalina and Rhoda oblige, then sexy times?

I dunno Ashley could most likely write a better fanfic than me.

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Warning! Incoherent rambling ahead! Possibly uncomfortable and raw on feelings. I started writing this last night but never finished. Tried to pick it up and finish it today but failed to beat the rambling into something readable, so I'm posting it as is...

Oh, there may be some who feel uncomfortable by the use of words like "freak" and "normal". The thing is that neither of these are absolutes, but both are things that a lot of people use in their mind when comparing themselves to those around them. For some being a freak means getting turned on by shoes, for others it might be wanting to have sex with bicycles, but only those with a "ladies" frame. Or it might be that you feel that being gay is enough that you label yourself as a freak. I'm not saying that it's healthy, but it certainly is way more common than it should be.

I've tried to read through it to make sure there aren't any really bad triggers, but I may have missed them. If you find anything really objectionable then drop a PM and I'll see if I can rework that part or I'll delete it all if necessary. Or you can just ask a moderator to nuke the post if it's that bad.

I know I had some idea I thought was important when I started writing this, but now I'n not certain I managed to communicate it in this text...

17 hours ago, hkmaly said:

What's surprising is she only had one relationship before Elliot with this attitude (well, two, but one was over internet). Although, maybe she's exhibitionist only when transformed?

She went with super cute, not deadly sexy for her date ...

Just because she likes to play a some what risky game with her friends it doesn't mean she's suddenly some kind of sex fiend.

She probably figured out that she's a "freak" at a very early age. Discovering that you are different from the "norm" can be quite hard on a kid. There are a lot of us here on this board that has gone through this, and a lot of posts has been written about how that has influenced our lives.

We have yet to learn anything about Ashley's parents. Most parents want their kids to be successful and fit into society, and usually this means they should be "normal", because that's what their parents taught them. It's easy to hurt someone unintentionally by assuming that your "normal" is going to fit all. At the same time you should not assume that any time someone is claiming something you consider part of the "normal" range to be abnormal they are doing so because they hate you. There are so many ways to deviate from any definition of "normal" you are likely to run into that it's almost bound to happen to all of us, even those who consider themselves cis normal heterosexual.

What we've seen of Ashley she seems well adjusted and outgoing. She doesn't seem to have many issues with her sexual orientation or gender. She has said she consider herself somewhat bisexual, and she's had fantasies about gender swapping and transformation of herself as well as of others. Of these only the part about being bisexual might have caused much of a negative reaction from others as the transformation and gender swapping are just fantasies as far as most know.

However even if her parents and close friends might not be bothered by her sexuality it's likely she's had enough people react negatively that she's taken to keeping that to her self only trusting close friends and potential boy or girl friends about it.

Secrets like these, as small and unimportant as some of them may seem, can easily cause a kid to classify itself as somewhat of a "freak", and that can put a damper on things like dating or even socializing with people they find themselves attracted to. In Ashley's case it can be as simple as her feeling that she doesn't want to have to choose between a girlfriend an a boyfriend, but that she want it all. Polyamory may be a hurdle for a youth trying to fit in and it's not certain that it would be the right thing for Ashley. Add bisexuality and it doesn't get easier. Now she's met Elliot, and it all started with her seeing him transform into a woman. Elliot ticks off some boxes in Ashley's spec sheet that no one else she's met could touch. Elliot can be both boyfriend and girlfriend without the need for a poly amorous relationship. This probably lowers the threshold significantly.

Her previous relationship was probably not something she went into wholeheartedly. I doubt she told him about her possible bisexuality or wishing she could have both a girlfriend and a boyfriend. She wanted to fit in with the rest of society and she needed to find out if she could be happy in a classical Boy / Girl relationship. Now she had the bad luck of hooking up with a manipulative jerk.

This time she met someone that fit her preferences way better, someone who is genuinely nice, and who is surrounded by family and friends that many would consider weirder freaks than her. Add that she has learned that magic is a real thing, that transformation isn't confined to comic's and fairy tales and suddenly sharing her fantasies and wishes with these new friends feels safe. Exhibitionism might or might not turn her on. Having wardrobe malfunctions in a game about transformations doesn't necessarily mean it's about sex or being sexy. It could just be another part of the game, and for what it's worth they are not likely to look much like themselves at any time after the game has started.

Edited by Cpt. Obvious
Softening some rough edges...

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@Cpt. Obvious: Very well explained. Thank you.

I have long considered making some sort of document that might be helpful for newcomers or people trying to understand indentity issues on these forums. This might be a good piece to include, if I can just get off my lazy behind and plan how to go about it. If you do not mind and would be kind enough to give permission, I would like to make this part of it.

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The big deal about Ashley is the idea of labels, she doesn't like labels because one word could mean different things to different people, in the case of "freak" it could either in relation to a person's sex habits, their appearance, their personality, or their various interests. So I don't think she'd agree with being called a freak. I do think she held back certain bits of info about herself though, Liz didn't know she had an internet girlfriend and thus likely didn't know that Ashley was attracted to females, but I think that's mainly due to Ashley feeling that kind of info doesn't need to be given out to random people  because it invites labelling, like when she first told Elliot about being attracted to females as well and he immediately asked if she was bisexual. It might not be that she doesn't trust others to accept her for what she does or who she likes, but she might not feel like having to explain the whole label issue to everyone each time it comes up.

Though it would be nice if people had to stop using labels to describe people, there might not be such division in groups if you couldn't lump em by label.

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3 hours ago, Scotty said:

there might not be such division in groups if you couldn't lump em by label.

Unfortunately, there will always be the labels of "Me, Us, and Them".

A given "Me" can quickly change a particular individual or group from "Them" to "Us", or vice versa.
But that change of opinion is never certain to happen.

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11 hours ago, Scotty said:

I dunno Ashley could most likely write a better fanfic than me.

I'm not sure. Those examples we were given were little ... short on plot.

11 hours ago, Scotty said:

Dan's doing this on purpose to give people fanfiction material isn't he? This is just like teasing Grace-Tedd-Sarah. Yeah, this isn't a canon storyline but the characters are in character,  something could happen in a canon setting, like now that magic is wide open and can be known, Ashley learns about Catalina's abilities since they go to the same school, then she learns of Rhoda's abilities and expresses a desire to be turned into a shrunken catgirl which Catalina and Rhoda oblige

Definitely.

11 hours ago, Scotty said:

then sexy times?

... maybe. Probably not. Unless they shrink Elliot as well.

9 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

for others it might be wanting to have sex with bicycles, but only those with a "ladies" frame

How would that even ... no, don't tell me, I don't want to know.

9 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

Now she's met Elliot, and it all started with her seeing him transform into a woman. Elliot ticks off some boxes in Ashley's spec sheet that no one else she's met could touch.

9 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

Her previous relationship was probably not something she went into wholeheartedly.

9 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

Now she's met Elliot, and it all started with her seeing him transform into a woman. Elliot ticks off some boxes in Ashley's spec sheet that no one else she's met could touch.

9 hours ago, Cpt. Obvious said:

Add that she has learned that magic is a real thing, that transformation isn't confined to comic's and fairy tales and suddenly sharing her fantasies and wishes with these new friends feels safe.

I feel almost bad not reacting to whole of your post ... it's good but thats what the emoticons are for.

But regarding these bits ... her "exhibitionism" gets new angle: she was probably hiding this part of her personality, because of fear it wouldn't be accepted. Even Liz was negative about what she share with her ... granted, Liz is goth and is probably negative to everything, but it could still confirm that fear.

But now she's with people who are into transformations themselves. Maybe not as much as her, but she still feels like she can finally stop hiding.

... makes sense she overdoes that.

6 hours ago, Scotty said:

Though it would be nice if people had to stop using labels to describe people, there might not be such division in groups if you couldn't lump em by label.

That would require not only stop being people, but maybe stop being sapient completely. Labels are how our thinking process works. We translate reality to symbols, label things so we can recognize them. We look around and label things: this is rock, this is also rock despite looking very different, this is plant, this is piece of wood and it was plant. Computers are bad at this and until they got better, they wouldn't be true AI.

Sometimes we overdo it. We forgot that when we used labels we simplified reality. We use labels to divide and ignore that the division in reality is not as neat as it looked with just labels. It's bad, of course, especially when that happens with other people. But it's understandable. And it doesn't mean we need to stop using labels completely. We just needs to be more careful with them and not put so big emphasis on them. Especially on people we want to spend more time with.

 

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35 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

I'm not sure. Those examples we were given were little ... short on plot.

But they'd at least be coherent.

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Labels are tricky, alright.  A few people have referred to Ashley as "kinky" and that's a word that gets used pretty broadly but also has definite implications.  To be plain, does "kinky" necessarily involve sex?  There doesn't seem to be a distinct other term for loving something for its own sake.  People often don't see "arousal" without attaching "sexual" to it.

If someone enjoys something seen as more extreme, like being flogged, they are termed "kinky."  That word is entwined with sexuality; I've heard repeatedly people saying, "My sexual orientation is kinky," meaning their choice of partner(s) is determined by shared activities more than by age, sex, gender, appearance, etc.  But if you get into the details, there are definitely people who enjoy the getting flogged as a completely separate experience from their sex lives.  They may have a strictly monogamous marriage with someone who isn't into it, and a BDSM partnership with someone who they 'play' with but with strict rules about not touching in certain ways, because those things would move the relationship into sex territory and that's only for their spouse, or even just unwelcome and unnecessary.

But if the "kink" is something else, something that hasn't gotten tangled up with the popular image of the sexy Dominatrix and handcuffs in the bedroom, then people seem to tend to see it the other way around.  Bungee jumping, say.  Or roller coasters.  It's exciting and a very intense experience, but people don't automatically link it with sex.  Ashley is "into" transformation, and we've seen enough of her to see that there probably is a sexual/sexuality component, but if you told an outsider about EGS you would probably just say Ashley is really into transformations, not that it's part of her sexual orientation, and they probably wouldn't fill in that blank on their own.  The default is different.

Does Ashley see Elliot as more desirable as a partner, not just intellectually but on a gut-level blushing-and-pupils-dilating kind if way, because he transforms?  And is that a true link to sexuality, or is it her being aroused by transformation, and interpreting that as being sexual because our culture makes that link between arousal and sex?  Would she have been just as happy to ride roller coasters for their own sake, if she hadn't bought into the link?  That gets into deep questions of where our attractions come from, and the short answer is that no one knows how all that works.  It's probably just as well we don't.

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10 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Ashley is "into" transformation, and we've seen enough of her to see that there probably is a sexual/sexuality component, but if you told an outsider about EGS you would probably just say Ashley is really into transformations, not that it's part of her sexual orientation, and they probably wouldn't fill in that blank on their own.

I suspect they WILL fill that blank if you add she's into male-to-female transformations. Actually the word is already there, as it's transformation of sex.

10 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

Does Ashley see Elliot as more desirable as a partner, not just intellectually but on a gut-level blushing-and-pupils-dilating kind if way, because he transforms?

Well we did saw her blushing. Although technically that may not be limited to sexual arousal either.

10 hours ago, CritterKeeper said:

And is that a true link to sexuality, or is it her being aroused by transformation, and interpreting that as being sexual because our culture makes that link between arousal and sex?

I think our bodies makes that link just fine even without culture. The culture is just reflecting it (and enhancing in the process). Why do you think winners tend to hug after race? If they are not so exhausted they barely stand, that is.

Of course, wanting to hug doesn't mean you go directly to sex. But the connection is there, only question is how strong it is, and if you go with it or attempt to stop it.

You can like something without any connection to sex, but the physiological reaction is from connection to sex.

(On the other hand, I was more sure about it before I went over my arguments and realized how many of them would actually be explainable by culture.)

 

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39 minutes ago, hkmaly said:

I think our bodies makes that link just fine even without culture. The culture is just reflecting it (and enhancing in the process). Why do you think winners tend to hug after race? If they are not so exhausted they barely stand, that is.

Of course, wanting to hug doesn't mean you go directly to sex. But the connection is there, only question is how strong it is, and if you go with it or attempt to stop it.

You can like something without any connection to sex, but the physiological reaction is from connection to sex.

(On the other hand, I was more sure about it before I went over my arguments and realized how many of them would actually be explainable by culture.)

That's just it.  We live in a culture that insists on putting a sexual spin on almost any physical contact.  I'm told men in India will hold hands as they walk if they are good friends, and no one thinks twice about it, let alone assumes they're a gay couple.  Male friends have told me they're afraid to hug a child who's crying, for fear of being accused of molestation.  Sometimes I'll give a client's child a boost so they can see the birds in our aviary better, and it occurs to me that a man would likely have to worry about picking up even a small child, for similar reasons.  I love interacting with children, and I'm quite glad at times that I am female and thus at least less likely to have to deal with such paranoia.

Close friendships seem to be an endangered species in the modern world.  Note all the jokes about Hercules and Xena when they were on, each traveling with a close friend of the same sex.  Once upon a time, entire families would share a single bed, even living in a single room; now, people call it sick for a mother to nurse her toddler or a father to let his daughter crawl into his bed after a nightmare.  Inns once might put several people in one bedroom, total strangers, and they were expected to sleep, nothing more, even in close contact if it were cold or a cheap (and thus small) bed.  Men could put their arms around each other and sing, without needing the excuse of being drunk.

Almost anything sensual is assumed to be sexual.  A massage can be a completely sensual experience, something to just experience and enjoy for its own sake.  You can be excited by a bungee jump or a roller coaster without wanting to head for the bedroom afterwards.  A cat can lie on your bare stomach and you can feel the fur and warmth and purring without any thought of bestiality.  Some things just feel good and there shouldn't be anything more to them!  (Note that there's nothing wrong with deliberately incorporating massage, fur, or thrilling leaps into roleplay, sensation play, etc.  It just shouldn't be mandatory to link them.)

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1 hour ago, CritterKeeper said:

Close friendships seem to be an endangered species in the modern world.  Note all the jokes about Hercules and Xena when they were on, each traveling with a close friend of the same sex.

Not sure how "modern" that is. Weren't the same "jokes" about Sherlock Holmes and dr. Watson? Frodo and Sam? They definitely WERE for Kirk and Spock.

1 hour ago, CritterKeeper said:

Once upon a time, entire families would share a single bed, even living in a single room; now, people call it sick for a mother to nurse her toddler or a father to let his daughter crawl into his bed after a nightmare.  Inns once might put several people in one bedroom, total strangers, and they were expected to sleep, nothing more, even in close contact if it were cold or a cheap (and thus small) bed.  Men could put their arms around each other and sing, without needing the excuse of being drunk.

I would say it's still not that bad around where I am ... and yes, this is definitely going overboard with it. On the other hand, this may be more about awareness of homosexual and incest relationships: it was ALWAYS seen as "suspicious" if unrelated and unmarried girl and boy were alone together ... and often for good reason.

1 hour ago, CritterKeeper said:

Almost anything sensual is assumed to be sexual.  A massage can be a completely sensual experience, something to just experience and enjoy for its own sake.  You can be excited by a bungee jump or a roller coaster without wanting to head for the bedroom afterwards.  A cat can lie on your bare stomach and you can feel the fur and warmth and purring without any thought of bestiality.  Some things just feel good and there shouldn't be anything more to them!  (Note that there's nothing wrong with deliberately incorporating massage, fur, or thrilling leaps into roleplay, sensation play, etc.  It just shouldn't be mandatory to link them.)

Of course feeling cat purr on your stomach doesn't mean you start thinking about bestiality. The idea is that it makes you thinking about having someone else warmth and purring on your stomach ... despite humans not really being good at purring, which may actually be one of reasons catgirls are so popular.

Connection doesn't mean it's the same thing. It can be strong or just weak. However, going down from adrenaline high is supposed to increase libido. There is reason why there were more children after war, and it wasn't just because noone dared to have light on during bombardment.

And yes, our culture IS perceiving the link stronger that it is in many cases. Just like the girl and boy alone together ... nothing may happen, they might not even think about it yet, but it's not like someone decided that it's related to sex: it's just recognizing what's happening in many (although not all) cases, generalizing it and blowing it bigger, often completely out of proportion.

 

 

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On 2/24/2018 at 7:57 PM, The Old Hack said:

@Cpt. Obvious: Very well explained. Thank you.

I have long considered making some sort of document that might be helpful for newcomers or people trying to understand indentity issues on these forums. This might be a good piece to include, if I can just get off my lazy behind and plan how to go about it. If you do not mind and would be kind enough to give permission, I would like to make this part of it.

A document like that might help getting people up to speed on these kinds of issues. At the same time I wouldn't have the guts to try to compose one. 

If it's any help you may use anything I've posted on this forum however you like for a project like this. 

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